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"Why don't these people get jobs?" Because: THERE. ARE. NOT. ENOUGH. JOBS. * The economy crashed a while ago. We still haven't recovered all the jobs we lost,

"Why don't these people get jobs?" Because: THERE. ARE. NOT. ENOUGH. JOBS. * The economy crashed a while ago. We still haven't recovered all the jobs we lost, by either absolute or percentage. * Increased automation and efficiency is slowly removing those jobs you just described. Exec, a YCombinator app, makes a more efficient and automated solution to craigslist cleaning jobs. This is happening in every sector in this country. These changes ELIMINATE JOBS, these jobs will never come back. And the jobs they create do not replace the ones they removed, not in quantity, or in aggregate tax quality (i.e. one well paid programmer does not replace the amount of tax revenue from 4 people splitting the same salary. Let alone the fact that executives often take a cut of that increased productivity for themselves. Let alone the fact that it puts more load on welfare for the 3 lost jobs). * Every single one of those jobs you just listed likely requires a number of things in today's saturated jobs market: High-school or college education (too many people, not enough jobs, means overqualified hiring requirements), a permanent address (hard when you are homeless), a certain appearance (hard when you are poor, without a place to live or bathe), some sort of experience (hard to get in this job market, especially when under educated, in poor health [mental or physical], and every other reason here), transport to and from work (or even for the work), ect. I think you need to take a step back and look at the whole picture, it's a dire one.

luscious 13y ago
There are always enough jobs. There aren't enough jobs that people are willing to do for the money others are willing to pay. If I knew someone near me was living on <$1/day, I would raise their pay to $5 to do something mundane. If that person could find 15-20 of me, they are above the poverty line. My standard of living has gone up and so has theirs AND they now can circulate that money to others in their service - and so it goes on. The problem isn't a lack of jobs, it's the draining of capital flow that happen when the monetary system dries up. Whether you believe that to be unfairness or just some players being so adept at the game... that doesn't matter. The ball needs to move or people who want to play the game will be sitting out. If the ball is kept moving, even artificially, anyone who wants to play will get to play. The only ones left out would be willingly out or mentally/physically unable to play at all. Right now, we let the game rules be such that some smart shits helped some lucky shits collect the ball and now the dumbshits think the pile of "money" is worth something when not in circulation. Look at all my symbols of currency! Doesn't matter if it's dollars, metals/commodities, or the butcoin... without a functioning-thriving ebb and flow of currency, everyone is poorer. Spend like death with 0 is the goal. Don't take on debt or get greedy. We'll all live better.
- lotsofcows 13y ago
  "There are always enough jobs." That's patently rubbish as can be seen all around the (1st) world at the moment. However, I don't agree with the parent's comment that technology causes a lack of jobs - also obviously untrue if you look around you. Currently we're on the tail-end of a recession, thus money isn't moving around, thus it's harder to insert one's self into the money stream. As people start spending, jobs pick up. This is already happening in most of the richer parts of the recession hit world. Here in the UK, unemployment has been dropping steadily. New small businesses are appearing fast. Manufacturing's on the way up. FWIW, I agree with everything after your very first sentence.
  - fantnn 13y ago
    The fact that there aren't currently enough jobs could very well be an unquantifiable negative externality of having a minimum wage.
- homeomorphic 13y ago
  > The problem isn't a lack of jobs, it's the draining of capital flow that happen when the monetary system dries up. Whether you believe that to be unfairness or just some players being so adept at the game... that doesn't matter. > The ball needs to move or people who want to play the game will be sitting out. If the ball is kept moving, even artificially, anyone who wants to play will get to play. The only ones left out would be willingly out or mentally/physically unable to play at all. What you're saying may be true now, but surely it won't always be true? Who's to say that every mundane task won't (relatively soon) be automated? We need to start thinking about how we should deal with this.
- Helianthus 13y ago
  >There are always enough jobs. There aren't enough jobs that people are willing to do for the money others are willing to pay. Nice. "Work willing to be done for others willing to pay" is what defines a job. It only took you two sentences to make the rest of your post into rubbish capitalist handwaving. >If I knew someone near me was living on <$1/day, I would raise their pay to $5 to do something mundane. Please do this actually. Someone near you is living on <$1/day. "It's not practical!" you'll say. That's because nothing you're saying is actually practical enough to be realistic.
specialist 13y ago
Agreed. Plus: * Lack of access to capital. I look around my neighborhood, city, state, country. There is no shortage of useful work to be done.
sliverstorm 13y ago
It's been my experience the jobs are there. They aren't necessarily falling out of the sky, but just two and a half years ago I worked on projects for a man who payed $10/hr and couldn't find enough (good) help. He told me workers were not hard to find (as he really only needed unskilled labor), but people with a good work ethic were. He was a great guy.

luscious 13y ago

There are always enough jobs. There aren't enough jobs that people are willing to do for the money others are willing to pay. If I knew someone near me was living on <$1/day, I would raise their pay to $5 to do something mundane. If that person could find 15-20 of me, they are above the poverty line. My standard of living has gone up and so has theirs AND they now can circulate that money to others in their service - and so it goes on. The problem isn't a lack of jobs, it's the draining of capital flow that happen when the monetary system dries up. Whether you believe that to be unfairness or just some players being so adept at the game... that doesn't matter. The ball needs to move or people who want to play the game will be sitting out. If the ball is kept moving, even artificially, anyone who wants to play will get to play. The only ones left out would be willingly out or mentally/physically unable to play at all. Right now, we let the game rules be such that some smart shits helped some lucky shits collect the ball and now the dumbshits think the pile of "money" is worth something when not in circulation. Look at all my symbols of currency! Doesn't matter if it's dollars, metals/commodities, or the butcoin... without a functioning-thriving ebb and flow of currency, everyone is poorer. Spend like death with 0 is the goal. Don't take on debt or get greedy. We'll all live better.

lotsofcows 13y ago
"There are always enough jobs." That's patently rubbish as can be seen all around the (1st) world at the moment. However, I don't agree with the parent's comment that technology causes a lack of jobs - also obviously untrue if you look around you. Currently we're on the tail-end of a recession, thus money isn't moving around, thus it's harder to insert one's self into the money stream. As people start spending, jobs pick up. This is already happening in most of the richer parts of the recession hit world. Here in the UK, unemployment has been dropping steadily. New small businesses are appearing fast. Manufacturing's on the way up. FWIW, I agree with everything after your very first sentence.
- fantnn 13y ago
  The fact that there aren't currently enough jobs could very well be an unquantifiable negative externality of having a minimum wage.
homeomorphic 13y ago
> The problem isn't a lack of jobs, it's the draining of capital flow that happen when the monetary system dries up. Whether you believe that to be unfairness or just some players being so adept at the game... that doesn't matter. > The ball needs to move or people who want to play the game will be sitting out. If the ball is kept moving, even artificially, anyone who wants to play will get to play. The only ones left out would be willingly out or mentally/physically unable to play at all. What you're saying may be true now, but surely it won't always be true? Who's to say that every mundane task won't (relatively soon) be automated? We need to start thinking about how we should deal with this.
Helianthus 13y ago
>There are always enough jobs. There aren't enough jobs that people are willing to do for the money others are willing to pay. Nice. "Work willing to be done for others willing to pay" is what defines a job. It only took you two sentences to make the rest of your post into rubbish capitalist handwaving. >If I knew someone near me was living on <$1/day, I would raise their pay to $5 to do something mundane. Please do this actually. Someone near you is living on <$1/day. "It's not practical!" you'll say. That's because nothing you're saying is actually practical enough to be realistic.

specialist 13y ago

Agreed. Plus: * Lack of access to capital. I look around my neighborhood, city, state, country. There is no shortage of useful work to be done.

sliverstorm 13y ago

It's been my experience the jobs are there. They aren't necessarily falling out of the sky, but just two and a half years ago I worked on projects for a man who payed $10/hr and couldn't find enough (good) help. He told me workers were not hard to find (as he really only needed unskilled labor), but people with a good work ethic were. He was a great guy.