5 ms·

That official gameplay video is really impressive if you haven't looked at the state of the art in video games lately. It looks like a wish list of gaming feat

That official gameplay video is really impressive if you haven't looked at the state of the art in video games lately. It looks like a wish list of gaming features put together by hardcore fans with no limits on budget or creativity. If I didn't know the game was released and well received, I'd say there's no way in hell it would be possible to put it all together on time, on budget, and without major flaws. Damn impressive.

sspiff 13y ago
I don't know about Rockstar, but from what I've heard from game developers from big studios, they're driven like slaves. Crunch time, unpaid overtime, wages that are not paid on time, etc etc. It's easier to be on time and on budget if you break rules like 8 hour days and proper remuneration of the workforce.
- joering2 13y ago
  Yes, but much harder to create such a strong brand that people are actually willing to be "ripped off" of time and wages. I cannot comment on quality of work for Rockstar tho.
  - sspiff 13y ago
    I agree, but many programmers start programming to make games. If that's still what you want to do by the time you graduate, that's possibly a dream you've been working on for 10+ years. If you're offered a bottom-level job at a great studio, these are often presented as a stepping stone to said dream, so many people end up there and stay until they're drained. Again, I can't testify that this is the case for Rockstar, but I know it's the case with some other major studio's.
- product50 13y ago
  If you don't know about Rockstar then don't comment. This is a great game and it really appears that the developers have put their everything in building it. Sometimes people want to work hard to make sure their output is a success. It is not always about 40hrs work week. A great company is one which creates a culture to build impressive products and where employees feel motivated to be a part of it. I am not saying that Rockstar employees worked more than 40hrs/week (I have no idea) but if I were a Rockstar employee I would be damn proud of the output.
  - valryon 13y ago
    For Red Dead Redemption, wives of the developers has written several open letters to show the world the horrible condition their husbands were facing. You can easily find this story, like on Gamasutra: http://www.gamasutra.com/blogs/RockstarSpouse/20100107/4032/Wives_of_Rockstar_San_Diego_employees_have_collected_themselves.php http://www.gamasutra.com/blogs/RockstarSpouse/20100107/4032/...
    - jiggy2011 13y ago
      So Rockstar San Diego is 100% male then?
      - antihero 13y ago
        Have you entirely missed the point?
        jiggy2011 13y ago
        It is signed "Determined Devoted Wives of Rockstar San Diego employees." So either it is 100% male OR the female staff are either unmarried or do not have the same complaints.
        sspiff 13y ago
        The fact that they're not represented in this letter doesn't mean they don't have these complains. They may not have voiced them, or voiced them privately or elsewhere. If I write a blog post about how I feel I'm being exploited by my employer, that doesn't necessarily mean my colleagues don't feel the same.
        jiggy2011 13y ago
        It is possible, but this looks like it was written on behalf of a large group of people and it seems strange to sign it in such a gender specific way.
- Wingman4l7 13y ago
  I don't know if this is actual industry lingo, but Penny Arcade has stories of "the trenches" to accompany its sister comic: http://trenchescomic.com/ http://trenchescomic.com/ Suffice to say that after reading those stories I'm never touching a QA/tester game industry job with a 10-foot pole.
- InclinedPlane 13y ago
  Slaves is probably not the right word, though working conditions in the game industry are on average pretty brutal. However, a big reason why they are is because there is such a huge pool of 20-something devs out there who are eagerly lined up to jump into gamedev. And it usually takes several years of living in that meat grinder for the scales to fall away from peoples' eyes, but even then as they leave there are plenty more lined up to take their place. From the perspective of management there's no problem at all, even though such working conditions actually cause a lot of fundamental issues in being able to successfully execute and continually losing the most senior and experienced devs as they get older and less tolerant of bullshit is kind of a big deal. See also: silicon valley startup culture.
- yeureka 13y ago
  In the Edinburgh office wages are much lower than in equivalent positions outside games, and everyone is waiting for a bonus to compensate for the crunch they had to put in to finish the game. I hope they do get a big bonus, my friend is basically living to work, not the other way around.
InclinedPlane 13y ago
Here's the video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N-xHcvug3WI http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N-xHcvug3WI Anyone else notice the nod to Vangelis' Blade Runner theme in the first part?

sspiff 13y ago

I don't know about Rockstar, but from what I've heard from game developers from big studios, they're driven like slaves. Crunch time, unpaid overtime, wages that are not paid on time, etc etc. It's easier to be on time and on budget if you break rules like 8 hour days and proper remuneration of the workforce.

joering2 13y ago
Yes, but much harder to create such a strong brand that people are actually willing to be "ripped off" of time and wages. I cannot comment on quality of work for Rockstar tho.
- sspiff 13y ago
  I agree, but many programmers start programming to make games. If that's still what you want to do by the time you graduate, that's possibly a dream you've been working on for 10+ years. If you're offered a bottom-level job at a great studio, these are often presented as a stepping stone to said dream, so many people end up there and stay until they're drained. Again, I can't testify that this is the case for Rockstar, but I know it's the case with some other major studio's.
product50 13y ago
If you don't know about Rockstar then don't comment. This is a great game and it really appears that the developers have put their everything in building it. Sometimes people want to work hard to make sure their output is a success. It is not always about 40hrs work week. A great company is one which creates a culture to build impressive products and where employees feel motivated to be a part of it. I am not saying that Rockstar employees worked more than 40hrs/week (I have no idea) but if I were a Rockstar employee I would be damn proud of the output.
- valryon 13y ago
  For Red Dead Redemption, wives of the developers has written several open letters to show the world the horrible condition their husbands were facing. You can easily find this story, like on Gamasutra: http://www.gamasutra.com/blogs/RockstarSpouse/20100107/4032/Wives_of_Rockstar_San_Diego_employees_have_collected_themselves.php http://www.gamasutra.com/blogs/RockstarSpouse/20100107/4032/...
  - jiggy2011 13y ago
    So Rockstar San Diego is 100% male then?
    - antihero 13y ago
      Have you entirely missed the point?
      - jiggy2011 13y ago
        It is signed "Determined Devoted Wives of Rockstar San Diego employees." So either it is 100% male OR the female staff are either unmarried or do not have the same complaints.
        sspiff 13y ago
        The fact that they're not represented in this letter doesn't mean they don't have these complains. They may not have voiced them, or voiced them privately or elsewhere. If I write a blog post about how I feel I'm being exploited by my employer, that doesn't necessarily mean my colleagues don't feel the same.
        jiggy2011 13y ago
        It is possible, but this looks like it was written on behalf of a large group of people and it seems strange to sign it in such a gender specific way.
Wingman4l7 13y ago
I don't know if this is actual industry lingo, but Penny Arcade has stories of "the trenches" to accompany its sister comic: http://trenchescomic.com/ http://trenchescomic.com/ Suffice to say that after reading those stories I'm never touching a QA/tester game industry job with a 10-foot pole.
InclinedPlane 13y ago
Slaves is probably not the right word, though working conditions in the game industry are on average pretty brutal. However, a big reason why they are is because there is such a huge pool of 20-something devs out there who are eagerly lined up to jump into gamedev. And it usually takes several years of living in that meat grinder for the scales to fall away from peoples' eyes, but even then as they leave there are plenty more lined up to take their place. From the perspective of management there's no problem at all, even though such working conditions actually cause a lot of fundamental issues in being able to successfully execute and continually losing the most senior and experienced devs as they get older and less tolerant of bullshit is kind of a big deal. See also: silicon valley startup culture.
yeureka 13y ago
In the Edinburgh office wages are much lower than in equivalent positions outside games, and everyone is waiting for a bonus to compensate for the crunch they had to put in to finish the game. I hope they do get a big bonus, my friend is basically living to work, not the other way around.

InclinedPlane 13y ago

Here's the video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N-xHcvug3WI http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N-xHcvug3WI Anyone else notice the nod to Vangelis' Blade Runner theme in the first part?