14 ms·

I'm sure we have a country like Norway somewhere in the United States. Perhaps New Hampshire? Just like we have a country in these United States to match any sm

by kghose 13y ago

I'm sure we have a country like Norway somewhere in the United States. Perhaps New Hampshire? Just like we have a country in these United States to match any small European country whose statistics are brought forward to push some kind of social agenda.

tazjin 13y ago
Hej from Sweden! Find me a US state (or area with equivalent population) with - national health care (dental might be exempted, but still capped after a certain amount) - stable, cheap, state-subsidized public transport with great coverage - school system equivalent to Sweden (though Sweden does arguably not have the best one in Europe I still encounter many shocking things when speaking to Americans) - included in that: ability to go to university without being in debt for the rest of your life / without scholarships / without rich family - clean cities, low crime rates, low to non-existent amount of guns in circulation - widespread atheism, embracing science - widespread high bandwidth, affordable internet access I could list more things but I think this is enough for now. I'm not saying that all of these are without flaws or that we are the best at them, but the US lacking so many of these in a widespread manner makes me not consider it a first world country. Edit: I forgot a big one! - Employment security: No unfair terminations, regulated pay, overtime/nightshift/weekend pay regulated ... Edit 2: This is in response to a "dead" comment I got. In case you've got show-dead disabled here's the comment "..And where your tax rate is up to 60% of your income. http://www.theguardian.com/money/2008/nov/16/sweden-tax-burd..." http://www.theguardian.com/money/2008/nov/16/sweden-tax-burd... - polaris9000 Yes, our tax rates are much higher but that's not the whole story. If you compare average personal income between Sweden and the US (I couldn't find a source on median income) you have approximately 10k USD more in net-income in the US. I'm not an expert in finances so I won't try to adjust this for things like the gap between poor&rich (which would pull the US down a bit). How much of these 10k are gone after spending them on all the things we get delivered through our taxes? (Health care, subsidised public transport, education and so on) And one thing that doesn't directly affect everybody's life quality: How much better is our infrastructure (paid for / subsidised by taxes)? I'm speaking about everything ranging from streets to power grids to internet connections. How much more stability do we have in our lives and how much better is the average life satisfaction? I'm sure there is no canonical answer to any of these but I'm also sure that Sweden scores better on average (and remember that this was originally about Norway, which is doing much better than Sweden)
- polaris9000 13y ago
  ..And where your tax rate is up to 60% of your income. http://www.theguardian.com/money/2008/nov/16/sweden-tax-burden-welfare http://www.theguardian.com/money/2008/nov/16/sweden-tax-burd...
  - dalke 13y ago
    And your point is ...? Please bear in mind that 1) that number is the highest marginal tax bracket, only paid by those with the most income, and 2) it's actually 57% not the rounded up value of 60%. For comparison, the marginal tax rate for the highest tax bracket in the US was above 60% during 1932-1986, with a peak was 91% in 1946-1964. Of course you're mostly just sniping numbers, since that article you quoted also says Swedes say they are "very happy to pay high taxes because I know I am getting value for the money later on." In the US we pay for things directly which are, in Sweden, paid indirectly through taxes. Do you really care if you pay 5% less in taxes only to have to pay 10% of your income per year in health care?
    - polaris9000 13y ago
      My point is: It's absurd to be paying over half of your income in taxes, regardless of whether you are living in the United States or Sweden. What is the incentive for someone to get a higher paying job then? Just to pay higher taxes? What is the point then? With that being the case, we should all just earn the lowest possible income then.
    - ahomescu1 13y ago
      > Do you really care if you pay 5% less in taxes only to have to pay 10% of your income per year in health care? There is one difference: you can't shop around. It's probably not a problem in Sweden, but in a lot of other "government provides everything" countries, there's a huge variation in quality of government-provided services (like schooling and doctors). You might get stuck with a crappy doctor (because of geographical assignment), while there's a great one on the next street. If I can keep my 5%, I pick my own doctor (within my budget).
Dewie 13y ago
USA the country is roughly equal to Europe the continent in square kilometers. I think the ability to compare USA the country and Europe the continent ends there, though.
Dewie 13y ago
The article is written by The Guardian. I control-f'd things like "usa" and "america" and found nothing in the article itself. But sure, the article was written to discredit America. Everything revolves around you.

by kghose 13y ago

tazjin 13y ago

Hej from Sweden! Find me a US state (or area with equivalent population) with - national health care (dental might be exempted, but still capped after a certain amount) - stable, cheap, state-subsidized public transport with great coverage - school system equivalent to Sweden (though Sweden does arguably not have the best one in Europe I still encounter many shocking things when speaking to Americans) - included in that: ability to go to university without being in debt for the rest of your life / without scholarships / without rich family - clean cities, low crime rates, low to non-existent amount of guns in circulation - widespread atheism, embracing science - widespread high bandwidth, affordable internet access I could list more things but I think this is enough for now. I'm not saying that all of these are without flaws or that we are the best at them, but the US lacking so many of these in a widespread manner makes me not consider it a first world country. Edit: I forgot a big one! - Employment security: No unfair terminations, regulated pay, overtime/nightshift/weekend pay regulated ... Edit 2: This is in response to a "dead" comment I got. In case you've got show-dead disabled here's the comment "..And where your tax rate is up to 60% of your income. http://www.theguardian.com/money/2008/nov/16/sweden-tax-burd..." http://www.theguardian.com/money/2008/nov/16/sweden-tax-burd... - polaris9000 Yes, our tax rates are much higher but that's not the whole story. If you compare average personal income between Sweden and the US (I couldn't find a source on median income) you have approximately 10k USD more in net-income in the US. I'm not an expert in finances so I won't try to adjust this for things like the gap between poor&rich (which would pull the US down a bit). How much of these 10k are gone after spending them on all the things we get delivered through our taxes? (Health care, subsidised public transport, education and so on) And one thing that doesn't directly affect everybody's life quality: How much better is our infrastructure (paid for / subsidised by taxes)? I'm speaking about everything ranging from streets to power grids to internet connections. How much more stability do we have in our lives and how much better is the average life satisfaction? I'm sure there is no canonical answer to any of these but I'm also sure that Sweden scores better on average (and remember that this was originally about Norway, which is doing much better than Sweden)

polaris9000 13y ago
..And where your tax rate is up to 60% of your income. http://www.theguardian.com/money/2008/nov/16/sweden-tax-burden-welfare http://www.theguardian.com/money/2008/nov/16/sweden-tax-burd...
- dalke 13y ago
  And your point is ...? Please bear in mind that 1) that number is the highest marginal tax bracket, only paid by those with the most income, and 2) it's actually 57% not the rounded up value of 60%. For comparison, the marginal tax rate for the highest tax bracket in the US was above 60% during 1932-1986, with a peak was 91% in 1946-1964. Of course you're mostly just sniping numbers, since that article you quoted also says Swedes say they are "very happy to pay high taxes because I know I am getting value for the money later on." In the US we pay for things directly which are, in Sweden, paid indirectly through taxes. Do you really care if you pay 5% less in taxes only to have to pay 10% of your income per year in health care?
  - polaris9000 13y ago
    My point is: It's absurd to be paying over half of your income in taxes, regardless of whether you are living in the United States or Sweden. What is the incentive for someone to get a higher paying job then? Just to pay higher taxes? What is the point then? With that being the case, we should all just earn the lowest possible income then.
  - ahomescu1 13y ago
    > Do you really care if you pay 5% less in taxes only to have to pay 10% of your income per year in health care? There is one difference: you can't shop around. It's probably not a problem in Sweden, but in a lot of other "government provides everything" countries, there's a huge variation in quality of government-provided services (like schooling and doctors). You might get stuck with a crappy doctor (because of geographical assignment), while there's a great one on the next street. If I can keep my 5%, I pick my own doctor (within my budget).

Dewie 13y ago

USA the country is roughly equal to Europe the continent in square kilometers. I think the ability to compare USA the country and Europe the continent ends there, though.

Dewie 13y ago

The article is written by The Guardian. I control-f'd things like "usa" and "america" and found nothing in the article itself. But sure, the article was written to discredit America. Everything revolves around you.