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This may actually be true at Return Path, but in my nearly 20 years of software developer experience, I've only seen a couple of companies for which I believe t

This may actually be true at Return Path, but in my nearly 20 years of software developer experience, I've only seen a couple of companies for which I believe this would be good advice. At most places the common wisdom holds and you should keep your job seeking activity a secret until you are ready to resign and give your two-weeks (at least, I've given more than two weeks in a few cases where the circumstances warranted it). As soon as you even hint that you're thinking of leaving you will be seen as "the other" and a bit of a traitor up and down the chain except perhaps by your peers who will envy you (in most cases the things that drive you away are likely making their job overly stressful as well). A lot of companies (even dedicated software shops, which is kind of mind boggling, but true IME) like to delude themselves into thinking programmers are just human resources like box lifters and with the proper amount of process you can just easily fit someone else into the role being vacated. They maintain this illusion even while knowing their people are thinking about leaving. In my experience it isn't until you make it official with a resignation letter that they snap out of this and go into "oh shit" mode and then attempt to offer real change. But by then it is too late, you've probably already accepted another job and mentally prepared to leave and unless the concessions are extremely, extremely substantial (and guaranteed somehow in your favor) you should virtually always just stick with leaving.

jlees 13y ago
At a smaller tech company (not sure how big Return Path is) it feels like so much investment is put into each hire that they don't really have the "replaceable parts" metaphor - and I know I'd rather know someone was unhappy and try to fix the reasons why, than suddenly learn they were going. I agree that the last-minute counter-offer can be way too late. (It's also pretty unfair if you've already accepted another job - I've heard of several cases of startups trying to hire people employed at larger companies who had the hire fall through due to a generous counter-offer.)
- slantyyz 13y ago
  I personally think it's always a bad idea to accept a counter-offer even if the only reason for your departure is money. Most of the things that drive you to leave are unlikely to change, and if you have to quit to get the money you think you deserve, what will you have to do to get raises in the future?
simplekoala 13y ago
Agree with this advice. There are many immature, egoistic, self-absorbent founders (consciously emulating wrong traits of Steve Jobs) that it is always better to play it safe, and leave like a professional instead of risking back-lashes, burning bridges by being open and forth-coming. What if you get fired immediately on the spot? People with work visa's should play the cards even close to their chest as their immigration status is tied to their employment. It takes a lot of courage, self-awareness, emotional maturity and discipline from management to handle situations like these. Most people cant handle a rejection. I am privy to two cases where people were fired on the spot when the management got to know they were actively interviewing or openly communicated that they are planning to move on. If you have a family to support, children and a mortgage err on the side of caution. Don't be naive.

jlees 13y ago

At a smaller tech company (not sure how big Return Path is) it feels like so much investment is put into each hire that they don't really have the "replaceable parts" metaphor - and I know I'd rather know someone was unhappy and try to fix the reasons why, than suddenly learn they were going. I agree that the last-minute counter-offer can be way too late. (It's also pretty unfair if you've already accepted another job - I've heard of several cases of startups trying to hire people employed at larger companies who had the hire fall through due to a generous counter-offer.)

slantyyz 13y ago
I personally think it's always a bad idea to accept a counter-offer even if the only reason for your departure is money. Most of the things that drive you to leave are unlikely to change, and if you have to quit to get the money you think you deserve, what will you have to do to get raises in the future?

simplekoala 13y ago

Agree with this advice. There are many immature, egoistic, self-absorbent founders (consciously emulating wrong traits of Steve Jobs) that it is always better to play it safe, and leave like a professional instead of risking back-lashes, burning bridges by being open and forth-coming. What if you get fired immediately on the spot? People with work visa's should play the cards even close to their chest as their immigration status is tied to their employment. It takes a lot of courage, self-awareness, emotional maturity and discipline from management to handle situations like these. Most people cant handle a rejection. I am privy to two cases where people were fired on the spot when the management got to know they were actively interviewing or openly communicated that they are planning to move on. If you have a family to support, children and a mortgage err on the side of caution. Don't be naive.