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So I should tip my hand and let people know I'm looking for other opportunities? If I'm looking for another position chances are I've already spoken to my manag

So I should tip my hand and let people know I'm looking for other opportunities? If I'm looking for another position chances are I've already spoken to my managers about things I'd like to see changed and they haven't listened. Telling someone I'm looking for another job offers no strategic advantage to me. If I get an offer and there is a counter-offer and I accept, I'm still the guy with no loyalty to the business and seen as expendable. Someone to be punished for daring to look outside the organization. Nothing good can come from that. I might give you two weeks if I think it will be honored and we can gracefully part ways. But let me tell you a little story about giving two weeks notice. I quit a startup this year because I wanted some things addressed and they were never addressed. Mainly dispute over equity and control of IP I had brought to the business from my previous startup. I laid this out in conversations, meetings, and in emails. They knew I wanted something done. But nothing happened. So I put my two weeks in and got an email back from the CEO almost instantly - I wouldn't have to wait two weeks they were letting me go immediately. And he cc'd almost everyone in the company. That's what being a nice guy gets you, a walk out the door.

general_failure 13y ago
Exactly my thoughts. I think in majority of cases people try a lot before they decide to quit. Why should people suddenly start listening to your ideas now? Isn't that like blackmail? Unless they get an offer that is out of this world by chance in which case they can't give the notice anyway.
mason55 13y ago
On the flip side, I had a junior dev quit without ever addressing any of his issues with me. Even in reviews where I asked him if he had any issues and even when I made it clear that he could come talk to me with any problems he had. We still had him work out his last two weeks and took him out to happy hour his second to last night... and then his last day he never showed up to do an exit interview and finish some handoffs.
- deleted 13y ago
  [deleted]
- georgemcbay 13y ago
  I don't know the particulars of the case you're talking about, but sometimes even if you're working at a place that you like and you aren't actively looking for work, other work finds you and you wind up with an offer that is far more attractive than your current place. This is why companies should always be proactively adjusting compensation, perks, etc to retain the people they can't afford to lose, though very few actually do this. In the end though, even if a company does keep up on the retaining side there are lots of reasons (eg. more interesting technical stack, new project instead of maintaining old one, etc) why someone who is mostly happy may still leave a job for another. Having said all of that, it sucks that the dev didn't show up for the last day. I hate exit interviews, but I'll still do them.
  - hga 13y ago
    No, just no. There is absolutely no upside to the employee in doing an exit intervew; rather than going into details, Nick "Ask the Headhunter" Corcodilos lays it out very well: http://www.asktheheadhunter.com/haexit.htm http://www.asktheheadhunter.com/haexit.htm First graph: "Exit interviews fascinate me like cockroaches do. An exit interview is the meeting a company's human resources department has with an employee who has been terminated or who has resigned. Like the Top Ten Stupid Interview Questions, exit interviews are the cockroaches of the human resources world: no one knows why they exist, no one can justify or eliminate them, and they will likely survive into the third millennium."
    - georgemcbay 13y ago
      Like I said, I hate them. I'll still do them, though. I don't mind jumping through the hoop and if the company really wants to hear the reasons I left, so be it, I will tell them bluntly and honestly. If they ask me personal questions I don't wish to answer, I will refuse to answer them. But I'll do the interview if they really want to do it (assuming, of course, I'm still living on their dime).
kyllo 13y ago
Some companies really do have a policy that if you quit (especially if you're leaving to work at a competitor, say for example you're quitting Microsoft to go work at Google) they will call security on the spot and escort you out.
- greenyoda 13y ago
  That's a pretty stupid policy. If you wanted to steal the company's proprietary information, you could easily have done so just before resigning, when you would have been under no suspicion. And if they escort you out immediately, they have no chance of getting an orderly transition from you to your successor: you walk out with all the useful knowledge in your head and they'll never have access to it again.
  - slantyyz 13y ago
    Might be a stupid policy for the company-- but depending on where you live, it can be a win for the person leaving. Where I live, if the employer waives notice and walks you out, you end up getting some free paid time off, without the drudgery of writing documentation and doing other boring transition tasks.
- ianstallings 13y ago
  They always have policies in place to protect themselves. That's why I have my own policies and don't pretend they are my friends. And just like them, my reason will be: It's just business.
ScottBurson 13y ago
I'm sure you realize this now, but the right time (really, the only time it's possible) to resolve equity and IP issues is before you start. And get it all in writing. If you start working as an employee without getting this done, you have zero leverage.

general_failure 13y ago

Exactly my thoughts. I think in majority of cases people try a lot before they decide to quit. Why should people suddenly start listening to your ideas now? Isn't that like blackmail? Unless they get an offer that is out of this world by chance in which case they can't give the notice anyway.

mason55 13y ago

On the flip side, I had a junior dev quit without ever addressing any of his issues with me. Even in reviews where I asked him if he had any issues and even when I made it clear that he could come talk to me with any problems he had. We still had him work out his last two weeks and took him out to happy hour his second to last night... and then his last day he never showed up to do an exit interview and finish some handoffs.

deleted 13y ago
[deleted]
georgemcbay 13y ago
I don't know the particulars of the case you're talking about, but sometimes even if you're working at a place that you like and you aren't actively looking for work, other work finds you and you wind up with an offer that is far more attractive than your current place. This is why companies should always be proactively adjusting compensation, perks, etc to retain the people they can't afford to lose, though very few actually do this. In the end though, even if a company does keep up on the retaining side there are lots of reasons (eg. more interesting technical stack, new project instead of maintaining old one, etc) why someone who is mostly happy may still leave a job for another. Having said all of that, it sucks that the dev didn't show up for the last day. I hate exit interviews, but I'll still do them.
- hga 13y ago
  No, just no. There is absolutely no upside to the employee in doing an exit intervew; rather than going into details, Nick "Ask the Headhunter" Corcodilos lays it out very well: http://www.asktheheadhunter.com/haexit.htm http://www.asktheheadhunter.com/haexit.htm First graph: "Exit interviews fascinate me like cockroaches do. An exit interview is the meeting a company's human resources department has with an employee who has been terminated or who has resigned. Like the Top Ten Stupid Interview Questions, exit interviews are the cockroaches of the human resources world: no one knows why they exist, no one can justify or eliminate them, and they will likely survive into the third millennium."
  - georgemcbay 13y ago
    Like I said, I hate them. I'll still do them, though. I don't mind jumping through the hoop and if the company really wants to hear the reasons I left, so be it, I will tell them bluntly and honestly. If they ask me personal questions I don't wish to answer, I will refuse to answer them. But I'll do the interview if they really want to do it (assuming, of course, I'm still living on their dime).

kyllo 13y ago

Some companies really do have a policy that if you quit (especially if you're leaving to work at a competitor, say for example you're quitting Microsoft to go work at Google) they will call security on the spot and escort you out.

greenyoda 13y ago
That's a pretty stupid policy. If you wanted to steal the company's proprietary information, you could easily have done so just before resigning, when you would have been under no suspicion. And if they escort you out immediately, they have no chance of getting an orderly transition from you to your successor: you walk out with all the useful knowledge in your head and they'll never have access to it again.
- slantyyz 13y ago
  Might be a stupid policy for the company-- but depending on where you live, it can be a win for the person leaving. Where I live, if the employer waives notice and walks you out, you end up getting some free paid time off, without the drudgery of writing documentation and doing other boring transition tasks.
ianstallings 13y ago
They always have policies in place to protect themselves. That's why I have my own policies and don't pretend they are my friends. And just like them, my reason will be: It's just business.

ScottBurson 13y ago

I'm sure you realize this now, but the right time (really, the only time it's possible) to resolve equity and IP issues is before you start. And get it all in writing. If you start working as an employee without getting this done, you have zero leverage.