3 ms·

If free will isn't real, why does it seem so real?

7 points by jballanc 17y ago

michael_dorfman 17y ago
Why try to frame this in terms of "evolutionary advantage"? There's absolutely no reason to believe that the belief in free will is not epiphenomenal, or a spandrel. I know that evolution is a very impressive hammer, but that still doesn't make every trait a nail.
- ram1024 17y ago
  more importantly the concept of free will cannot be defined in the first place. you can make claims that the future is perfectly predetermined, but there is zero possible way to justify that claim to be true or false. you could also easily make the case that randomness does exist, and quantum theory would support that, but you still wouldn't be able to say that any of your actions were restricted from occuring or not. the bottom line is, you are always going to do what you chose to do. regardless of how locked in that sounds, you DID make that choice. thusly your free will was executed as good as it needs to be. analyzing it further creates no useful discussion
Raphael 17y ago
Free will is doing (or at least imagining) what you want or feel is best. Your moods, whims, desires, and so forth can be controlled by inevitable subatomic physics, and those are synthesized by your thought processes to take a course of action. Since your brain wiring and chemical balance will be unique in a subtle way, that gives you a personality you can call your own. Imagine if everyone were required to change at least one line of code in their software before running it. The different computers would seem like they had all kinds of strange motives.
- jhancock 17y ago
  Your comment suggests that "free will" in a human mind is a result of small differences in the makeup/brain chemistry of the individual. Its my understanding that the 'free will theorem" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_will_theorem http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_will_theorem is not that. It says "if we have a certain amount of "free will", then, subject to certain assumptions, so do some elementary particles." It may well be that both your perspective _and_ the free will theorem are at play.
tungstenfurnace 17y ago
Perhaps free will seems unreal because you believe that you can only make one choice in any situation, and that this choice is predetermined by physics. However, according to the many-worlds interpretation of QM, you do in fact make every possible decision, in every situation.

7 points by jballanc 17y ago

Why try to frame this in terms of "evolutionary advantage"? There's absolutely no reason to believe that the belief in free will is not epiphenomenal, or a spandrel. I know that evolution is a very impressive hammer, but that still doesn't make every trait a nail.

ram1024 17y ago
more importantly the concept of free will cannot be defined in the first place. you can make claims that the future is perfectly predetermined, but there is zero possible way to justify that claim to be true or false. you could also easily make the case that randomness does exist, and quantum theory would support that, but you still wouldn't be able to say that any of your actions were restricted from occuring or not. the bottom line is, you are always going to do what you chose to do. regardless of how locked in that sounds, you DID make that choice. thusly your free will was executed as good as it needs to be. analyzing it further creates no useful discussion

Raphael 17y ago

Free will is doing (or at least imagining) what you want or feel is best. Your moods, whims, desires, and so forth can be controlled by inevitable subatomic physics, and those are synthesized by your thought processes to take a course of action. Since your brain wiring and chemical balance will be unique in a subtle way, that gives you a personality you can call your own. Imagine if everyone were required to change at least one line of code in their software before running it. The different computers would seem like they had all kinds of strange motives.

jhancock 17y ago
Your comment suggests that "free will" in a human mind is a result of small differences in the makeup/brain chemistry of the individual. Its my understanding that the 'free will theorem" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_will_theorem http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_will_theorem is not that. It says "if we have a certain amount of "free will", then, subject to certain assumptions, so do some elementary particles." It may well be that both your perspective _and_ the free will theorem are at play.

tungstenfurnace 17y ago

Perhaps free will seems unreal because you believe that you can only make one choice in any situation, and that this choice is predetermined by physics. However, according to the many-worlds interpretation of QM, you do in fact make every possible decision, in every situation.