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Stallman, et. al are also against anyone making any money from building software. He's said as much, that he thinks software engineers should work as waiters ra

Stallman, et. al are also against anyone making any money from building software. He's said as much, that he thinks software engineers should work as waiters rather than work on anything which isn't entirely free. So, naturally he's against Apple which happens to make a lot of money from building software.

Samuel_Michon 13y ago
A case could be made that Apple and FSF are on the same page there. Apple’s revenues from software sales pale in comparison to its total revenue. Apple makes software in order to sell more hardware, that’s why they make so little software for other platforms. Apple either gives its software away or it sells it for way less than similar products by competitors. Today, Apple announced it will start giving its iLife and iWork apps away for free with all new iOS devices. Currently, Apple sells its OS X upgrades for $20 and it’s not unthinkable that they will start it giving it away, as they already do with iOS upgrades. Other examples are Apple’s Pro apps. It would acquire those apps from other companies and then discontinue the versions for other platforms while slashing the prices for OS X.
- morgante 13y ago
  > A case could be made that Apple and FSF are on the same page there. Not really. Apple is very big into free software, but only free as in beer. As you note, they build that software (and give it away effectively for free) in order to sell more hardware. The second they make it free as in speech every competitor can pick it up and put it on commodity hardware, destroying a major strength of Apple.
chatman 13y ago
What are you even talking about?? "Stallman, et. al are also against anyone making any money from building software" This is utter non-sense. I think you are confusing "free as in freedom" with "free as in free beer". Stallman openly says free software can be commercially developed and supported. Just that the users should have certain freedoms to use it. The developers can sell copies of their free software if they choose to.
- morgante 13y ago
  In a NYC talk, Stallman readily said that software developers should absolutely never work for any company developing closed source software (ie. the vast majority of software companies) and should instead work as waiters, developing free software in their free time. [1]: http://isoc-ny.org/p2/5844 http://isoc-ny.org/p2/5844
  - teddyh 13y ago
    You apparently think that "commercial" and "making money from software" must, must mean "proprietary" and "closed source" software. RMS and the FSF disagree strongly with this and see no inherent conflict between the two. Either you didn't know and were honestly ignorant, or you were deliberately trying to confuse the issue.
    - morgante 13y ago
      I know they disagree with this, but the fact remains that it's very challenging to make money off open source software. Few companies are able to sustain such a business model, particularly if the target market is consumers with no interest in retaining consulting services.
      - teddyh 13y ago
        Now you've changed the subject from "Stallman, et. al are also against anyone making any money from building software" to "[...] it's very challenging to make money off open source software", which is a separate point entirely.

Samuel_Michon 13y ago

A case could be made that Apple and FSF are on the same page there. Apple’s revenues from software sales pale in comparison to its total revenue. Apple makes software in order to sell more hardware, that’s why they make so little software for other platforms. Apple either gives its software away or it sells it for way less than similar products by competitors. Today, Apple announced it will start giving its iLife and iWork apps away for free with all new iOS devices. Currently, Apple sells its OS X upgrades for $20 and it’s not unthinkable that they will start it giving it away, as they already do with iOS upgrades. Other examples are Apple’s Pro apps. It would acquire those apps from other companies and then discontinue the versions for other platforms while slashing the prices for OS X.

morgante 13y ago
> A case could be made that Apple and FSF are on the same page there. Not really. Apple is very big into free software, but only free as in beer. As you note, they build that software (and give it away effectively for free) in order to sell more hardware. The second they make it free as in speech every competitor can pick it up and put it on commodity hardware, destroying a major strength of Apple.

chatman 13y ago

What are you even talking about?? "Stallman, et. al are also against anyone making any money from building software" This is utter non-sense. I think you are confusing "free as in freedom" with "free as in free beer". Stallman openly says free software can be commercially developed and supported. Just that the users should have certain freedoms to use it. The developers can sell copies of their free software if they choose to.

morgante 13y ago
In a NYC talk, Stallman readily said that software developers should absolutely never work for any company developing closed source software (ie. the vast majority of software companies) and should instead work as waiters, developing free software in their free time. [1]: http://isoc-ny.org/p2/5844 http://isoc-ny.org/p2/5844
- teddyh 13y ago
  You apparently think that "commercial" and "making money from software" must, must mean "proprietary" and "closed source" software. RMS and the FSF disagree strongly with this and see no inherent conflict between the two. Either you didn't know and were honestly ignorant, or you were deliberately trying to confuse the issue.
  - morgante 13y ago
    I know they disagree with this, but the fact remains that it's very challenging to make money off open source software. Few companies are able to sustain such a business model, particularly if the target market is consumers with no interest in retaining consulting services.
    - teddyh 13y ago
      Now you've changed the subject from "Stallman, et. al are also against anyone making any money from building software" to "[...] it's very challenging to make money off open source software", which is a separate point entirely.