4 ms·

Background: Currently teaching Intro to Programming using VB (not even 2012... cause our lead instructor's textbook is for 2010). I created a stir when I sugges

by tsumnia 13y ago

Background: Currently teaching Intro to Programming using VB (not even 2012... cause our lead instructor's textbook is for 2010). I created a stir when I suggested we move to C, which we are next semester. Many of people have already commented on this, but from my understanding, this parent did NOTHING and it going a passive-aggressive route to complain. Going into the article, I was excited to read it initially because I was going to use it in a discussion piece in the class. When I got to the end... not so much. Does IT attract socially inept male students who resort to real-life trolling? Yes. Quite honestly, it is my opinion THIS is the reason why we have so few women in the industry. Tons of guys get interested via video games, well what happens when a female gamer 'slips up' and reveals she's not a male? Creepy PMs and sexism. People want to dance around the issue and say its from few role models and the like; no, spend 5 minutes acting like a female online (however you'd do it), you'll see it immediately. My Steam tag is an old MacHall webcomic joke ('Susan'). If I don't have my mic on and just do basic banter in chat, yes I get the occasional guy getting too friendly. Getting back to the article, not to defend the instructor, but they saw the female was (at one point) positively responding to the jokes. Should something have been done? Depends on the class dynamic, in my opinion. I can't accurately tell how the class ran based on this blog (as it is a biased one side to the story). Without getting into anymore of a rant, VB isn't bad, per say... it teaches variables, loops, and conditionals, the basics of any intro class. I'd only have a problem with this if it was a high-level college course.

jere 13y ago
>Many of people have already commented on this, but from my understanding, this parent did NOTHING and it going a passive-aggressive route to complain. Did we read the same article? >I consulted with friends — female developers — and talked to my daughter about how to handle the situation in class. I suggested that she talk to you. I offered to talk to you. I offered to come talk to the class. I offered to send one of my male friends, perhaps a well-known local programmer, to go talk to the class. Unless I'm misunderstanding, the author claims to have spoken to the teacher and offer solutions... then writes a letter clearly outlining more solutions. >Without getting into anymore of a rant, VB isn't bad, per say... it teaches variables, loops, and conditionals, the basics of any intro class. I'd only have a problem with this if it was a high-level college course. Going to have to agree with you here. I think the teacher is going to have a much better impact than the language involved. For example, a friend and classmate took a Java course during high school. The teacher did nothing but force them to copy programs out of the book. I took a VB course and learned quite a bit. By the end of the class, I was writing games in my down time (pong, asteroids, a raycasting engine, etc.)
- hdctambien 13y ago
  > Unless I'm misunderstanding, the author claims to have spoken to the teacher and offer solutions The author spoke with her daughter about things she could do: talk to the class, have a friend talk to the class, etc and the daughter decided that she would rather "plow through" than have her mom come to her high school and talk to her class.
- tsumnia 13y ago
  To me it sounds like she made those offers to everyone but the instructor. There is no mention to the instructor's reaction to this offer. Also, when she later mentions the instructor 'not noticing' the daughter's less eager attitude, it gives me the opinion she never brought this up to the instructor. I might be wrong, but that seemed to be a discussion point in this thread so far.
Pxtl 13y ago
"Too-friendly" creepiness is one thing. It's hard to blame awkward lonely guys for being awkward lonely guys. Outright misogyny is a whole other kettle of fish.
- tsumnia 13y ago
  Actually, it is easy to blame them. If a bar had the reputation of crawling with sexist assholes and awkward lonely guys, how would the organization fair? The owner can't say 'Oh well, that's how our customers are' if they want to expand into different demographics. Bouncers and staff are put into place to quell that type of behavior. In IT, can teachers help quell the behavior? Yes, but we can't be the sole guardians when the rest of the internet is still behaving that way. How do you change that? I don't know, I just do the best I can.

by tsumnia 13y ago

jere 13y ago

>Many of people have already commented on this, but from my understanding, this parent did NOTHING and it going a passive-aggressive route to complain. Did we read the same article? >I consulted with friends — female developers — and talked to my daughter about how to handle the situation in class. I suggested that she talk to you. I offered to talk to you. I offered to come talk to the class. I offered to send one of my male friends, perhaps a well-known local programmer, to go talk to the class. Unless I'm misunderstanding, the author claims to have spoken to the teacher and offer solutions... then writes a letter clearly outlining more solutions. >Without getting into anymore of a rant, VB isn't bad, per say... it teaches variables, loops, and conditionals, the basics of any intro class. I'd only have a problem with this if it was a high-level college course. Going to have to agree with you here. I think the teacher is going to have a much better impact than the language involved. For example, a friend and classmate took a Java course during high school. The teacher did nothing but force them to copy programs out of the book. I took a VB course and learned quite a bit. By the end of the class, I was writing games in my down time (pong, asteroids, a raycasting engine, etc.)

hdctambien 13y ago
> Unless I'm misunderstanding, the author claims to have spoken to the teacher and offer solutions The author spoke with her daughter about things she could do: talk to the class, have a friend talk to the class, etc and the daughter decided that she would rather "plow through" than have her mom come to her high school and talk to her class.
tsumnia 13y ago
To me it sounds like she made those offers to everyone but the instructor. There is no mention to the instructor's reaction to this offer. Also, when she later mentions the instructor 'not noticing' the daughter's less eager attitude, it gives me the opinion she never brought this up to the instructor. I might be wrong, but that seemed to be a discussion point in this thread so far.

Pxtl 13y ago

"Too-friendly" creepiness is one thing. It's hard to blame awkward lonely guys for being awkward lonely guys. Outright misogyny is a whole other kettle of fish.

tsumnia 13y ago
Actually, it is easy to blame them. If a bar had the reputation of crawling with sexist assholes and awkward lonely guys, how would the organization fair? The owner can't say 'Oh well, that's how our customers are' if they want to expand into different demographics. Bouncers and staff are put into place to quell that type of behavior. In IT, can teachers help quell the behavior? Yes, but we can't be the sole guardians when the rest of the internet is still behaving that way. How do you change that? I don't know, I just do the best I can.