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How about Wahhabi Jihadists that are being brought in from all over the world to fight Assad regime. There is a good piece by German media that talks about how

by pipy 13y ago

How about Wahhabi Jihadists that are being brought in from all over the world to fight Assad regime. There is a good piece by German media that talks about how Europe is supporting ultra-extremist insurgency in Syria [1] by turning the blind eye on Turkey, which is providing al-Qaeda affiliated jihadists with arms, shelter and healthcare. They gather in Turkey, then proceed to fighting Assad regime and massacring civilians by hundreds in the spare time. [2][3] Who is going to "show limits" to them? Syrian rebels in the Damascus suburb of Ghouta have admitted to Associated Press correspondent Dale Gavlak that they were responsible for last week’s chemical weapons incident which western powers have blamed on Bashar Al-Assad’s forces, revealing that the casualties were the result of an accident caused by rebels mishandling chemical weapons provided to them by Saudi Arabia. “From numerous interviews with doctors, Ghouta residents, rebel fighters and their families… many believe that certain rebels received chemical weapons via the Saudi intelligence chief, Prince Bandar bin Sultan, and were responsible for carrying out the (deadly) gas attack,” writes Dale Gavlak. [4] Dale Gavlak has been a Middle East correspondent for the Associated Press for two decades and has also worked for National Public Radio (NPR) and written articles for BBC News. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-pdvbinNLH8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-pdvbinNLH8 [2] http://www.opendemocracy.net/rozh-ahmad/mass-slaughter-of-civilian-kurds-in-syria-ignites-heavy-clashes-and-mass-exodus http://www.opendemocracy.net/rozh-ahmad/mass-slaughter-of-ci... [3] Search the Web for "Lattakia Massacre" (caution, very explicit content!) [4] http://www.mintpressnews.com/witnesses-of-gas-attack-say-saudis-supplied-rebels-with-chemical-weapons/168135/ http://www.mintpressnews.com/witnesses-of-gas-attack-say-sau... First posted in another HN thread. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6313967 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6313967

bayesianhorse 13y ago
The situation in Syria is extremely complicated. The presence of "jihadists" does not exculpate nearly anything I said. Even if the opposition consisted only of extreme islamic jihadists (which they obviously don't) destroying living quarters of millions of civilians (who are supposedly on Assad's side according to the regime version of the truth) is hardly the best way to deal with them. I can't help but feel that the fact that a lot of the victims are muslim is playing a big role in making this genocide "Ok".
- pipy 13y ago
  >I can't help but feel that the fact that a lot of the victims are muslim is playing a big role in making this genocide "Ok". This is not the point. The point is who will suffer as the result of the American and French bombings. And the ones to suffer the most are Syrian people. This is Kosovo all over again. "The casualties among Serb civilians in the first three weeks of the war are higher than all of the casualties on both sides in Kosovo in the three months that led up to this war, and yet those three months were supposed to be a humanitarian catastrophe." [1] >Even if the opposition consisted only of extreme islamic jihadists (which they obviously don't). Even CNN now admits that FSA is completely overwhelmed by jihadists. [2] Even if you were right, dropping more bombs won't solve the issues in Syria. [1] http://www.chomsky.info/books/humanism01.htm http://www.chomsky.info/books/humanism01.htm [2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IKnll7oVy9k https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IKnll7oVy9k
  - bayesianhorse 13y ago
    The planned military intervention does not want to "solve" the problem. It wants to send a message beyond Syria. It's about holding people accountable for genocide. I also have to ask: Why exactly is it that the FSA is "completely overwhelmed"? At the start that was clearly not the case. Hm, now is there some authority in Syria that wanted to frame the conflict from the start as a democratically elected leader against foreign jihadists? Could it be that said authority targeted primarily the non-jihadists over the last two years?
    - pipy 13y ago
      The planned military intervention does not want to "solve" the problem. It wants to send a message beyond Syria. It's about holding people accountable for genocide. I have raised my concerns about this position here. [1] I also have to ask: Why exactly is it that the FSA is "completely overwhelmed"? At the start that was clearly not the case. Hm, now is there some authority in Syria that wanted to frame the conflict from the start as a democratically elected leader against foreign jihadists? Could it be that said authority targeted primarily the non-jihadists over the last two years? I think that the most plausible explanation is that the jihadi movement had more external support. War is expensive: all sides of the conflict are in need of arms, food, medical and other supplies, training and expertize. And the FSA has got least. I think that Assad is generally not a good guy. And that FSA has had legitimacy at the start of the war. Probably, Assad would've liked to frame the conflict as "Assad" vs "Jihadists/Foreign-sponsored freedom fighters" from the very beginning. But the conflict has indeed became a proxy war with many sides, and the FSA has got caught in the middle of them. [2] [3] [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6327563 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6327563 [2] http://www.policymic.com/articles/28414/syria-civil-war-u-s--backed-iraq-government-attacks-u-s--backed-syrian-rebels http://www.policymic.com/articles/28414/syria-civil-war-u-s-... [3] http://www.juancole.com/2013/09/government-rejects-strike.html http://www.juancole.com/2013/09/government-rejects-strike.ht...

by pipy 13y ago

bayesianhorse 13y ago

The situation in Syria is extremely complicated. The presence of "jihadists" does not exculpate nearly anything I said. Even if the opposition consisted only of extreme islamic jihadists (which they obviously don't) destroying living quarters of millions of civilians (who are supposedly on Assad's side according to the regime version of the truth) is hardly the best way to deal with them. I can't help but feel that the fact that a lot of the victims are muslim is playing a big role in making this genocide "Ok".

pipy 13y ago
>I can't help but feel that the fact that a lot of the victims are muslim is playing a big role in making this genocide "Ok". This is not the point. The point is who will suffer as the result of the American and French bombings. And the ones to suffer the most are Syrian people. This is Kosovo all over again. "The casualties among Serb civilians in the first three weeks of the war are higher than all of the casualties on both sides in Kosovo in the three months that led up to this war, and yet those three months were supposed to be a humanitarian catastrophe." [1] >Even if the opposition consisted only of extreme islamic jihadists (which they obviously don't). Even CNN now admits that FSA is completely overwhelmed by jihadists. [2] Even if you were right, dropping more bombs won't solve the issues in Syria. [1] http://www.chomsky.info/books/humanism01.htm http://www.chomsky.info/books/humanism01.htm [2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IKnll7oVy9k https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IKnll7oVy9k
- bayesianhorse 13y ago
  The planned military intervention does not want to "solve" the problem. It wants to send a message beyond Syria. It's about holding people accountable for genocide. I also have to ask: Why exactly is it that the FSA is "completely overwhelmed"? At the start that was clearly not the case. Hm, now is there some authority in Syria that wanted to frame the conflict from the start as a democratically elected leader against foreign jihadists? Could it be that said authority targeted primarily the non-jihadists over the last two years?
  - pipy 13y ago
    The planned military intervention does not want to "solve" the problem. It wants to send a message beyond Syria. It's about holding people accountable for genocide. I have raised my concerns about this position here. [1] I also have to ask: Why exactly is it that the FSA is "completely overwhelmed"? At the start that was clearly not the case. Hm, now is there some authority in Syria that wanted to frame the conflict from the start as a democratically elected leader against foreign jihadists? Could it be that said authority targeted primarily the non-jihadists over the last two years? I think that the most plausible explanation is that the jihadi movement had more external support. War is expensive: all sides of the conflict are in need of arms, food, medical and other supplies, training and expertize. And the FSA has got least. I think that Assad is generally not a good guy. And that FSA has had legitimacy at the start of the war. Probably, Assad would've liked to frame the conflict as "Assad" vs "Jihadists/Foreign-sponsored freedom fighters" from the very beginning. But the conflict has indeed became a proxy war with many sides, and the FSA has got caught in the middle of them. [2] [3] [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6327563 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6327563 [2] http://www.policymic.com/articles/28414/syria-civil-war-u-s--backed-iraq-government-attacks-u-s--backed-syrian-rebels http://www.policymic.com/articles/28414/syria-civil-war-u-s-... [3] http://www.juancole.com/2013/09/government-rejects-strike.html http://www.juancole.com/2013/09/government-rejects-strike.ht...