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I appreciate your input, especially as counterweight to those who underestimate the sophistication of these tests. However I question your absolute statement.

by crucini 13y ago

I appreciate your input, especially as counterweight to those who underestimate the sophistication of these tests. However I question your absolute statement. What man can create, man can circumvent. (How's that for an absolute statement?) Would you say that the people who created the test cannot game it?

dylangs1030 13y ago
No, it can certainly be gamed. It's just so hard without prior knowledge and preparation as to be statistically negligent. This is also why I said you should avoid giving the same test twice. But a single, cold test administration should be very difficult to game. You should also read upthread, what the actual psychologist said. It clarified my comment really well.
- foobarbazqux 13y ago
  > But a single, cold test administration should be very difficult to game. Oh come on. This was posted in a different comment: http://www.physicschick.com/pole/2012xxxx/psych.txt http://www.physicschick.com/pole/2012xxxx/psych.txt The following are very obviously the "correct" true or false answers to these questions from the MMPI-2: T * My mother is a good woman. F * Evil spirits possess me at times. F * There seems to be a lump in my throat much of the time. T * At times I feel like swearing. T * My hands and feet are usually warm enough. F * Ghosts or spirits can influence people for good or bad. F * Someone has been trying to poison me. F * Everything tastes the same. F * Someone has been trying to rob me. F * Bad words, often terrible words, come into my mind and I cannot get rid of them. F * Often I feel as if there is a tight band around my head. F * Peculiar odors come to me at times. F * My soul sometimes leaves my body. F * When a man is with a woman he is usually thinking about things related to her sex. F * I often feel as if things are not real. F * Someone has it in for me. F * My neck spots with red often. T * Once in awhile I laugh at a dirty joke. F * I hear strange things when I am alone. F * In walking I am very careful to step over sidewalk cracks. F * At one or more times in my life, I felt that someone was making me do things by hypnotizing me. I cut out a few because I couldn't see how true or false mattered.
  - dylangs1030 13y ago
    Those are the obvious ones. I've taken the MMPI. There's a lot more than just those. None of these are the seemingly innocuous ones I was talking about. Again, I'll reiterate: can they be gamed? Yes. Is it likely? Emphatically, no.
    - foobarbazqux 13y ago
      Okay, I didn't know you've taken the MMPI, so fair enough. I would be surprised if answers to the innocuous questions were that important though; they strike me more as luring you into a sense of complacency and so that you end up answering honestly when it comes to the important ones.
- crucini 13y ago
  Now that I've read some more, I'm curious. Are you referring to the MMPI or something similar? Or to Unicru and Kenexa? Unicru seems to ask much more prosaic questions than MMPI. And yes, when I speak of gaming, I am assuming prior knowledge and preparation - but not necessarily inside knowledge.

by crucini 13y ago

dylangs1030 13y ago

No, it can certainly be gamed. It's just so hard without prior knowledge and preparation as to be statistically negligent. This is also why I said you should avoid giving the same test twice. But a single, cold test administration should be very difficult to game. You should also read upthread, what the actual psychologist said. It clarified my comment really well.

foobarbazqux 13y ago
> But a single, cold test administration should be very difficult to game. Oh come on. This was posted in a different comment: http://www.physicschick.com/pole/2012xxxx/psych.txt http://www.physicschick.com/pole/2012xxxx/psych.txt The following are very obviously the "correct" true or false answers to these questions from the MMPI-2: T * My mother is a good woman. F * Evil spirits possess me at times. F * There seems to be a lump in my throat much of the time. T * At times I feel like swearing. T * My hands and feet are usually warm enough. F * Ghosts or spirits can influence people for good or bad. F * Someone has been trying to poison me. F * Everything tastes the same. F * Someone has been trying to rob me. F * Bad words, often terrible words, come into my mind and I cannot get rid of them. F * Often I feel as if there is a tight band around my head. F * Peculiar odors come to me at times. F * My soul sometimes leaves my body. F * When a man is with a woman he is usually thinking about things related to her sex. F * I often feel as if things are not real. F * Someone has it in for me. F * My neck spots with red often. T * Once in awhile I laugh at a dirty joke. F * I hear strange things when I am alone. F * In walking I am very careful to step over sidewalk cracks. F * At one or more times in my life, I felt that someone was making me do things by hypnotizing me. I cut out a few because I couldn't see how true or false mattered.
- dylangs1030 13y ago
  Those are the obvious ones. I've taken the MMPI. There's a lot more than just those. None of these are the seemingly innocuous ones I was talking about. Again, I'll reiterate: can they be gamed? Yes. Is it likely? Emphatically, no.
  - foobarbazqux 13y ago
    Okay, I didn't know you've taken the MMPI, so fair enough. I would be surprised if answers to the innocuous questions were that important though; they strike me more as luring you into a sense of complacency and so that you end up answering honestly when it comes to the important ones.
crucini 13y ago
Now that I've read some more, I'm curious. Are you referring to the MMPI or something similar? Or to Unicru and Kenexa? Unicru seems to ask much more prosaic questions than MMPI. And yes, when I speak of gaming, I am assuming prior knowledge and preparation - but not necessarily inside knowledge.