5 ms·

In the future, when video playback isn't restored and Google makes a public admission that they don't intend on restoring it, would you mind if I remind you of

by ihsw 13y ago

In the future, when video playback isn't restored and Google makes a public admission that they don't intend on restoring it, would you mind if I remind you of how you were naive and foolish? When Google's next hardware product comes out, can we stop thanking them and instead point out how they have a history of releasing products that give users no control over what runs on them? Google has far more technical expertise than any ISP, so it stands to reason that they'll be using that to push down on users more than any other ISP has in the past. We may yet regret clamoring for Google Fiber to be everywhere.

thezilch 13y ago
Entitled much? What obligations does Google have here, exactly?
- burntsushi 13y ago
  Huh? The GP comment never mentioned or implied the word "obligation".
  - thezilch 13y ago
    The ultimatum is for Google to restore undocumented functionality or publicly state they don't support openness. And we're all fools to think Google will go to the ends of the earth to support everything imaginable! Replace Google with Apple in the GP to understand the entitlement and just how foolish we aren't.
    - burntsushi 13y ago
      Sorry, but I just don't see it. All I see is a complaint and a demand for a feature. IMO, that's not entitlement. Entitlement would use words like "owe" and "responsibility".
- ihsw 13y ago
  I don't feel entitled to anything, I just take a perverse amount of pleasure in pointing out how much shit people are full of. I'm just trying to encourage some honesty from an intellectual perspective -- why confuse ourselves when the outcome will be no different than the last? Why do we willfully continue to lock ourselves into an ecosystem, be it Google, Facebook, or Apple?
anxiousest 13y ago
Only if you don't mind to be reminded of your own foolishness when similar functionality is enabled through SDK. I don't understand this animosity towards Google, it's like every little change to the status quo triggers a hate-fest here on HN accompanied with wild accusations (only to be debunked soon after). They pushed a system update that broke undocumented APIs, they could be patching a security vulnerability for all you know, there is no need to commence spreading FUD about some other unrelated initiative.
- ihsw 13y ago
  If Google were to correct me then I would gladly eat my hat. Personally I feel no such animosity towards Google, however any perceived hostility towards Google is purely coincidental -- my hatred is towards bait&switch and other parasitic corporate practices.
  - deleted 13y ago
    [deleted]
- micampe 13y ago
  > I don't understand this animosity towards Google, it's like every little change to the status quo triggers a hate-fest here on HN accompanied with wild accusations It’s not just Google, we like drama around here.
jmillikin 13y ago
> When Google's next hardware product comes out, can we > stop thanking them and instead point out how they have a > history of releasing products that give users no control > over what runs on them? Consumer hardware devices that Google has released so far are: Nexus {One,S,Galaxy,4,7,10,Q}, Glass, Chromebook Pixel, Chromecast. All of the Nexus devices (except for the abandoned-before-launch Q) have official support for flashing custom firmware. The Chromebook Pixel comes with "developer mode", which turns it into a standard unverified laptop. Glass can be unlocked, and Google employees demonstrated how to install Ubuntu on it at Google IO. Other than the Chromecast, which devices do you feel restrict the user from controlling which code they run?
- ihsw 13y ago
  Past performance isn't the only indicator of future performance. What will you say when it's revealed that the Chromcast is Google's first foray into locked hardware, and that they liked how it was well-received by consumers?
  - Karunamon 13y ago
    and what will you say when you're wrong? either scenario is just as likely from the information available
jkn 13y ago
I can't think of any tech company in Google's league that matches them in terms of device openness. The Nexus phones and tablets officially support flashing of custom ROMs.[1,2] The Moto X will have an unlockable bootloader on carriers that allow it.[3] Google gave a tutorial on how to root Glass (see the I/O talk "Voiding Your Warranty: Hacking Glass" [4]). All Chromebooks have a developer mode that can be accessed using a hardware switch or key combination. See e.g. [5,6] for the Samsung ARM and Pixel Chromebooks. Google even provides instructions for disassembling the Chromebooks ([5,6], at the bottom). I don't think it's wise to ignore Google's history and extrapolate the future based exclusively on an SDK preview. [EDIT: Downvoters, I would be curious to know your motivations.] [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Android_rooting http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Android_rooting [2] http://android-developers.blogspot.ch/2010/12/its-not-rooting-its-openness.html http://android-developers.blogspot.ch/2010/12/its-not-rootin... [3] https://plus.google.com/+PunitSoni/posts/e6oQdFnLGiv https://plus.google.com/+PunitSoni/posts/e6oQdFnLGiv [4] https://developers.google.com/events/io/sessions/332704837 https://developers.google.com/events/io/sessions/332704837 [5] http://www.chromium.org/chromium-os/developer-information-for-chrome-os-devices/samsung-arm-chromebook http://www.chromium.org/chromium-os/developer-information-fo... [6] http://www.chromium.org/chromium-os/developer-information-for-chrome-os-devices/chromebook-pixel http://www.chromium.org/chromium-os/developer-information-fo...
dannyr 13y ago
What is there to restore if Google never enabled it through the SDK in the first place?

by ihsw 13y ago

thezilch 13y ago

Entitled much? What obligations does Google have here, exactly?

burntsushi 13y ago
Huh? The GP comment never mentioned or implied the word "obligation".
- thezilch 13y ago
  The ultimatum is for Google to restore undocumented functionality or publicly state they don't support openness. And we're all fools to think Google will go to the ends of the earth to support everything imaginable! Replace Google with Apple in the GP to understand the entitlement and just how foolish we aren't.
  - burntsushi 13y ago
    Sorry, but I just don't see it. All I see is a complaint and a demand for a feature. IMO, that's not entitlement. Entitlement would use words like "owe" and "responsibility".
ihsw 13y ago
I don't feel entitled to anything, I just take a perverse amount of pleasure in pointing out how much shit people are full of. I'm just trying to encourage some honesty from an intellectual perspective -- why confuse ourselves when the outcome will be no different than the last? Why do we willfully continue to lock ourselves into an ecosystem, be it Google, Facebook, or Apple?

anxiousest 13y ago

Only if you don't mind to be reminded of your own foolishness when similar functionality is enabled through SDK. I don't understand this animosity towards Google, it's like every little change to the status quo triggers a hate-fest here on HN accompanied with wild accusations (only to be debunked soon after). They pushed a system update that broke undocumented APIs, they could be patching a security vulnerability for all you know, there is no need to commence spreading FUD about some other unrelated initiative.

ihsw 13y ago
If Google were to correct me then I would gladly eat my hat. Personally I feel no such animosity towards Google, however any perceived hostility towards Google is purely coincidental -- my hatred is towards bait&switch and other parasitic corporate practices.
- deleted 13y ago
  [deleted]
micampe 13y ago
> I don't understand this animosity towards Google, it's like every little change to the status quo triggers a hate-fest here on HN accompanied with wild accusations It’s not just Google, we like drama around here.

jmillikin 13y ago

> When Google's next hardware product comes out, can we > stop thanking them and instead point out how they have a > history of releasing products that give users no control > over what runs on them? Consumer hardware devices that Google has released so far are: Nexus {One,S,Galaxy,4,7,10,Q}, Glass, Chromebook Pixel, Chromecast. All of the Nexus devices (except for the abandoned-before-launch Q) have official support for flashing custom firmware. The Chromebook Pixel comes with "developer mode", which turns it into a standard unverified laptop. Glass can be unlocked, and Google employees demonstrated how to install Ubuntu on it at Google IO. Other than the Chromecast, which devices do you feel restrict the user from controlling which code they run?

ihsw 13y ago
Past performance isn't the only indicator of future performance. What will you say when it's revealed that the Chromcast is Google's first foray into locked hardware, and that they liked how it was well-received by consumers?
- Karunamon 13y ago
  and what will you say when you're wrong? either scenario is just as likely from the information available

jkn 13y ago

I can't think of any tech company in Google's league that matches them in terms of device openness. The Nexus phones and tablets officially support flashing of custom ROMs.[1,2] The Moto X will have an unlockable bootloader on carriers that allow it.[3] Google gave a tutorial on how to root Glass (see the I/O talk "Voiding Your Warranty: Hacking Glass" [4]). All Chromebooks have a developer mode that can be accessed using a hardware switch or key combination. See e.g. [5,6] for the Samsung ARM and Pixel Chromebooks. Google even provides instructions for disassembling the Chromebooks ([5,6], at the bottom). I don't think it's wise to ignore Google's history and extrapolate the future based exclusively on an SDK preview. [EDIT: Downvoters, I would be curious to know your motivations.] [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Android_rooting http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Android_rooting [2] http://android-developers.blogspot.ch/2010/12/its-not-rooting-its-openness.html http://android-developers.blogspot.ch/2010/12/its-not-rootin... [3] https://plus.google.com/+PunitSoni/posts/e6oQdFnLGiv https://plus.google.com/+PunitSoni/posts/e6oQdFnLGiv [4] https://developers.google.com/events/io/sessions/332704837 https://developers.google.com/events/io/sessions/332704837 [5] http://www.chromium.org/chromium-os/developer-information-for-chrome-os-devices/samsung-arm-chromebook http://www.chromium.org/chromium-os/developer-information-fo... [6] http://www.chromium.org/chromium-os/developer-information-for-chrome-os-devices/chromebook-pixel http://www.chromium.org/chromium-os/developer-information-fo...

dannyr 13y ago

What is there to restore if Google never enabled it through the SDK in the first place?