4 ms·

The US really could stand to learn a few things from Henry L. Stimson, who held many important political positions related to foreign policy during the first ha

The US really could stand to learn a few things from Henry L. Stimson, who held many important political positions related to foreign policy during the first half of the 20th century. Here are two choice quotes: "The only way to make a man trustworthy is to trust him; and the surest way to make him untrustworthy is to distrust him and show your distrust." and "Gentlemen don't read each other's mail." The US Government doesn't act with trust and goodwill towards anyone and therefor should not be surprised that no one else shows us trust and goodwill back. Given this news, it would be most fitting if the UN decided to move its headquarters elsewhere. My vote is for Berlin.

gruseom 13y ago
Stimson was talking about people. Nations aren't people (they "have no friends, only interests", as the saying goes), and it's a mistake to anthropomorphize them.
- devx 13y ago
  I disagree. What made US so great and so loved by the world were its values, and being a role model (a good one that is) for every other country. Being just as bad as China or Russia and showing complete distrust in partners and allies, and forcing their hands to do what they want is a good way to ruin that whole image for US, and create an environment that is hostile towards US internationally, instead of everyone wanting to cooperate with US (without being threatened or blackmailed, that is). People have interests, too. They just learned to cooperate with each other in a harmonious environment to be as productive as possible. Double crossing and being conflictual at every turn is not productive for people, nor for nations. Besides, it's people that create those relationships between nations.
  - ianhawes 13y ago
    No, what makes the United States so great and loved by the world is the opportunity it provides.
saraid216 13y ago
How can you say this and then proceed to distrust the government and show it your distrust?
- malandrew 13y ago
  Maybe because they've lied on numerous occasions. Every 2 or 4 years the nation chooses to trust another group of people, many of which quickly lose the trust of those they are supposed to be representing. A government is not a single entity, but it made of individuals. I trust some of those individuals more than others. Hiding one of the biggest surveillance programs without ever getting consent for it, is a complete and utter betrayal of trust. I trusted them to respect the 1st and 4th amendment. That trust was betrayed when they choose to play fast and loose with those two constitutional rights. Now that we are demanding to know what is going on, they retreat to more lies as opposed to opening up and trying to earn that trust back.
munin 13y ago
Stimson was also the Secretary of War during WW2, which saw the creation and explosive growth of signals intelligence. As Secretary of War, he would have overseen the bulk of American signals intelligence and cryptanalysis, which let us view the Japanese and German thoughts in real-time and gave us an incredible advantage. ULTRA and related efforts saved convoy shipping across the Atlantic, gave the Allies North Africa, and won Midway (among many other victories). The irony is that he said "Gentlemen do not read each other's mail" as the Secretary of State, when he was made aware of the American Black Chamber. The Black Chamber was the one of the first "production line" signals intelligence units in the US government, and Stimson had it shut down due to his ethical concerns. This set the US at a signifigant disadvantage entering WW2, as we had to start on signals intelligence from scratch and learn a lot from the British (and what was left of the French and Polish signals intelligence units). It is telling that when it became truly necessary, these earlier ethical concerns were discarded in the face of military necessity.
- grey-area 13y ago
  Nowadays, of course, the US is eternally at war with a ever-changing and indistinct enemy, the terrorist, and so military necessity requires ignoring those ethical concerns permanently.
dylangs1030 13y ago
Nations that act like gentlemen are wiped out. Even the most cursory perusal of non-revisionist history makes this clear. Nations aren't people. If you're a nation, you read even your allies' mail.

gruseom 13y ago

Stimson was talking about people. Nations aren't people (they "have no friends, only interests", as the saying goes), and it's a mistake to anthropomorphize them.

devx 13y ago
I disagree. What made US so great and so loved by the world were its values, and being a role model (a good one that is) for every other country. Being just as bad as China or Russia and showing complete distrust in partners and allies, and forcing their hands to do what they want is a good way to ruin that whole image for US, and create an environment that is hostile towards US internationally, instead of everyone wanting to cooperate with US (without being threatened or blackmailed, that is). People have interests, too. They just learned to cooperate with each other in a harmonious environment to be as productive as possible. Double crossing and being conflictual at every turn is not productive for people, nor for nations. Besides, it's people that create those relationships between nations.
- ianhawes 13y ago
  No, what makes the United States so great and loved by the world is the opportunity it provides.

saraid216 13y ago

How can you say this and then proceed to distrust the government and show it your distrust?

malandrew 13y ago
Maybe because they've lied on numerous occasions. Every 2 or 4 years the nation chooses to trust another group of people, many of which quickly lose the trust of those they are supposed to be representing. A government is not a single entity, but it made of individuals. I trust some of those individuals more than others. Hiding one of the biggest surveillance programs without ever getting consent for it, is a complete and utter betrayal of trust. I trusted them to respect the 1st and 4th amendment. That trust was betrayed when they choose to play fast and loose with those two constitutional rights. Now that we are demanding to know what is going on, they retreat to more lies as opposed to opening up and trying to earn that trust back.

munin 13y ago

Stimson was also the Secretary of War during WW2, which saw the creation and explosive growth of signals intelligence. As Secretary of War, he would have overseen the bulk of American signals intelligence and cryptanalysis, which let us view the Japanese and German thoughts in real-time and gave us an incredible advantage. ULTRA and related efforts saved convoy shipping across the Atlantic, gave the Allies North Africa, and won Midway (among many other victories). The irony is that he said "Gentlemen do not read each other's mail" as the Secretary of State, when he was made aware of the American Black Chamber. The Black Chamber was the one of the first "production line" signals intelligence units in the US government, and Stimson had it shut down due to his ethical concerns. This set the US at a signifigant disadvantage entering WW2, as we had to start on signals intelligence from scratch and learn a lot from the British (and what was left of the French and Polish signals intelligence units). It is telling that when it became truly necessary, these earlier ethical concerns were discarded in the face of military necessity.

grey-area 13y ago
Nowadays, of course, the US is eternally at war with a ever-changing and indistinct enemy, the terrorist, and so military necessity requires ignoring those ethical concerns permanently.

dylangs1030 13y ago

Nations that act like gentlemen are wiped out. Even the most cursory perusal of non-revisionist history makes this clear. Nations aren't people. If you're a nation, you read even your allies' mail.