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All of these "install ... on Chromebook" articles fail to mention that on recent Chromebooks without a physical developer mode switch (Samsung's ARM-based one,

by avian 13y ago

All of these "install ... on Chromebook" articles fail to mention that on recent Chromebooks without a physical developer mode switch (Samsung's ARM-based one, Pixel) you have to press a specific hidden keyboard combination and endure the big scary "developer mode" warning on each boot. In my view that makes it practically useless for day-to-day use as a general purpose laptop. You can flash the first stage bootloader to remove that warning, but that is not documented well (if you can call several contradictory forum threads documentation), involves taking the laptop apart and gives you exactly one try: it either works or bricks the device permanently. In addition to that, at least Samsung's Chromebooks are not very well designed and can be seriously damaged from userspace when running a general-purpose distribution (Google for burning speakers on ARM Chromebook for instance)

rwmj 13y ago
Agree with all your points. On the other hand, these are cheap, widely available A15 devices with a reasonable amount of RAM, and that has a certain appeal for people who need ARM-based developer machines (we used them for porting Fedora, KVM, libvirt, libguestfs and the virt tools to ARM). Also I used one for 2+ weeks exclusively (running Fedora 18) and it wasn't that bad: http://rwmj.wordpress.com/2013/01/16/some-thoughts-after-2-5-weeks-with-the-samsung-chromebook/#content http://rwmj.wordpress.com/2013/01/16/some-thoughts-after-2-5...
jdn 13y ago
The developer mode warning only occurs on boot, as you say. Having owned by the ARM Chromebook and the Pixel since both were released, I've probably seen that warning less than 8 times since install. The Chromebooks very rarely need to be turned off, and the one time that does happen often, on update restarts, actually bypasses that warning.
- avian 13y ago
  It really depends what you want to do. If you just run a chroot inside the stock ChromeOS then what you say is true. But if you're dual-booting to another Linux distribution or just replace ChromeOS altogether (that's another issue with the linked article: what it describes is not a dual-boot) you can't escape frequent reboots. Especially due to flaky suspend/sleep mode support in other distros.
  - jdn 13y ago
    True, but the chroot is by far the most common and most stable method, and the one targetted in the article. Though as you say, the title is wrong.
broodbucket 13y ago
On regular laptops, you open the lid and press the "On" button. On my Chromebook, it boots as soon as you open the lid, and so I press Ctrl-D instead of the "On" button. I thought it'd be a pain, but it doesn't bother me at all, and you say that makes it "practically useless"?
- tuananh 13y ago
  He exaggerated to make a point but Ctrl D every single time you boot is kinda annoying.
  - jonknee 13y ago
    One more finger annoying than the power button which is what you would do on any other laptop. There is not a desktop Linux user alive who has not put up with more annoying things than hitting two keys to boot.
    - avian 13y ago
      Incidentally, I'm a desktop Linux user for more than 10 years. I don't mind having to do annoying things once or twice to set things up. I do mind having to do them each and every time I pick up the computer, especially when I have bought it believing that I won't have to.
- DHowett 13y ago
  The problem is that it's not just ^D on every boot, it's "press space twice in a thirty-second window and it will unceremoniously wipe all your data without a timeout." This will happen the moment you hand your computer to somebody of the sort who clicks through dialogs they don't ubderdtand, as the computer shuts off when it's slept for long enough. (The infuriating bit is how difficult it is to enter developer mode: two very secret keypresses and a thirty-second "please reconsider" grace period.)
bsimpson 13y ago
I am typing this on the Pixel that's been my main machine since I/O in May. Yeah, that screen is minorly annoying, but it goes away with one keystroke - not a dealbreaker.
- jlgreco 13y ago
  Can't say I'm bothered either. It might concern me if I were recommending a Pixel with regular Linux on it to a non-power user... but I wouldn't do that anyway.
timdiggerm 13y ago
>Btw, on Pixel you don’t have this physical switch. You can just use a keyboard combination: Press and hold the Esc and Refresh keys while you hit the Power button Source: The article you're commenting on
- jlgreco 13y ago
  That's not quite what he is talking about. With the Pixel every single time you boot (not just when you initially put it into Developer Mode before installation) you are greeted with a nice big warning label about OS verification and you need to press Ctrl-L to kick it into SeaBIOS so that Grub can be kicked off. It turns on and off as normal after installation, you just need to hit Ctrl-L mid-boot each time. I reboot infrequently enough that this hasn't annoyed me yet.

by avian 13y ago

rwmj 13y ago

Agree with all your points. On the other hand, these are cheap, widely available A15 devices with a reasonable amount of RAM, and that has a certain appeal for people who need ARM-based developer machines (we used them for porting Fedora, KVM, libvirt, libguestfs and the virt tools to ARM). Also I used one for 2+ weeks exclusively (running Fedora 18) and it wasn't that bad: http://rwmj.wordpress.com/2013/01/16/some-thoughts-after-2-5-weeks-with-the-samsung-chromebook/#content http://rwmj.wordpress.com/2013/01/16/some-thoughts-after-2-5...

jdn 13y ago

The developer mode warning only occurs on boot, as you say. Having owned by the ARM Chromebook and the Pixel since both were released, I've probably seen that warning less than 8 times since install. The Chromebooks very rarely need to be turned off, and the one time that does happen often, on update restarts, actually bypasses that warning.

avian 13y ago
It really depends what you want to do. If you just run a chroot inside the stock ChromeOS then what you say is true. But if you're dual-booting to another Linux distribution or just replace ChromeOS altogether (that's another issue with the linked article: what it describes is not a dual-boot) you can't escape frequent reboots. Especially due to flaky suspend/sleep mode support in other distros.
- jdn 13y ago
  True, but the chroot is by far the most common and most stable method, and the one targetted in the article. Though as you say, the title is wrong.

broodbucket 13y ago

On regular laptops, you open the lid and press the "On" button. On my Chromebook, it boots as soon as you open the lid, and so I press Ctrl-D instead of the "On" button. I thought it'd be a pain, but it doesn't bother me at all, and you say that makes it "practically useless"?

tuananh 13y ago
He exaggerated to make a point but Ctrl D every single time you boot is kinda annoying.
- jonknee 13y ago
  One more finger annoying than the power button which is what you would do on any other laptop. There is not a desktop Linux user alive who has not put up with more annoying things than hitting two keys to boot.
  - avian 13y ago
    Incidentally, I'm a desktop Linux user for more than 10 years. I don't mind having to do annoying things once or twice to set things up. I do mind having to do them each and every time I pick up the computer, especially when I have bought it believing that I won't have to.
DHowett 13y ago
The problem is that it's not just ^D on every boot, it's "press space twice in a thirty-second window and it will unceremoniously wipe all your data without a timeout." This will happen the moment you hand your computer to somebody of the sort who clicks through dialogs they don't ubderdtand, as the computer shuts off when it's slept for long enough. (The infuriating bit is how difficult it is to enter developer mode: two very secret keypresses and a thirty-second "please reconsider" grace period.)

bsimpson 13y ago

I am typing this on the Pixel that's been my main machine since I/O in May. Yeah, that screen is minorly annoying, but it goes away with one keystroke - not a dealbreaker.

jlgreco 13y ago
Can't say I'm bothered either. It might concern me if I were recommending a Pixel with regular Linux on it to a non-power user... but I wouldn't do that anyway.

timdiggerm 13y ago

>Btw, on Pixel you don’t have this physical switch. You can just use a keyboard combination: Press and hold the Esc and Refresh keys while you hit the Power button Source: The article you're commenting on

jlgreco 13y ago
That's not quite what he is talking about. With the Pixel every single time you boot (not just when you initially put it into Developer Mode before installation) you are greeted with a nice big warning label about OS verification and you need to press Ctrl-L to kick it into SeaBIOS so that Grub can be kicked off. It turns on and off as normal after installation, you just need to hit Ctrl-L mid-boot each time. I reboot infrequently enough that this hasn't annoyed me yet.