4 ms·

I don't mean this as hostile as it will unfortunately likely come across, but, do you not see a hint of irony here?

by bhauer 13y ago

enraged_camel 13y ago
I do see a hint of irony. I'm open to changing my opinion on what conservatism is if I encounter enough data that overwhelmingly points in the other direction: that conservatives are very accepting of new ideas and viewpoints. So far, I have not.
- bhauer 13y ago
  Very well. As another anecdote, I have met many conservatives who are willing to discuss and debate ideas. None of these conservatives I have met has acted or said anything that suggests they believe women are incapable of management. I have met chauvinists and I have met conservatives. I don't see a whole lot of correlation.
  - enraged_camel 13y ago
    There's a huge difference between being willing to discuss and debate ideas, and being actually open to changing one's opinions on the subject.
    - bhauer 13y ago
      I suppose. But those two notions are related, and I think appealing to an interest to discuss and debate honestly without fear of jumping to name-calling is a peaceful way to go about changing minds. I absolutely will never change minds if I belittle my adversary.
- gyardley 13y ago
  Of course conservatism isn't very accepting of new ideas and viewpoints. Nothing political you can slap a label on, and that includes any of the left-wing varieties, is very accepting of new ideas and viewpoints. Otherwise, the label itself would be meaningless. (That's not to say the meanings of these political labels don't change at all, but it takes a hell of a long time.) When individuals decide to accept new ideas and viewpoints, this creates conflict with the label they've chosen to apply to themselves. Enough new ideas, and they simply start call themselves something else. A conservative open to too many new ideas will stop calling themselves conservative, and a liberal open to too many new ideas will stop calling themselves liberal. This happens all the time, in both directions - it's the people that change, not the labels.

I don't mean this as hostile as it will unfortunately likely come across, but, do you not see a hint of irony here?

by bhauer 13y ago

I don't mean this as hostile as it will unfortunately likely come across, but, do you not see a hint of irony here?

I do see a hint of irony. I'm open to changing my opinion on what conservatism is if I encounter enough data that overwhelmingly points in the other direction: that conservatives are very accepting of new ideas and viewpoints. So far, I have not.

bhauer 13y ago
Very well. As another anecdote, I have met many conservatives who are willing to discuss and debate ideas. None of these conservatives I have met has acted or said anything that suggests they believe women are incapable of management. I have met chauvinists and I have met conservatives. I don't see a whole lot of correlation.
- enraged_camel 13y ago
  There's a huge difference between being willing to discuss and debate ideas, and being actually open to changing one's opinions on the subject.
  - bhauer 13y ago
    I suppose. But those two notions are related, and I think appealing to an interest to discuss and debate honestly without fear of jumping to name-calling is a peaceful way to go about changing minds. I absolutely will never change minds if I belittle my adversary.
gyardley 13y ago
Of course conservatism isn't very accepting of new ideas and viewpoints. Nothing political you can slap a label on, and that includes any of the left-wing varieties, is very accepting of new ideas and viewpoints. Otherwise, the label itself would be meaningless. (That's not to say the meanings of these political labels don't change at all, but it takes a hell of a long time.) When individuals decide to accept new ideas and viewpoints, this creates conflict with the label they've chosen to apply to themselves. Enough new ideas, and they simply start call themselves something else. A conservative open to too many new ideas will stop calling themselves conservative, and a liberal open to too many new ideas will stop calling themselves liberal. This happens all the time, in both directions - it's the people that change, not the labels.