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Please accept my apologies - almost 2 years in Japan has put an end to my capacity for writing proper English. I did intend to say that people seemed to be as

by jbm 17y ago

Please accept my apologies - almost 2 years in Japan has put an end to my capacity for writing proper English. I did intend to say that people seemed to be as intelligent (or not) as they were when I had started reading this site. The education piece, as you mention, is (at most) a once-a-week ego-stroking event. It has become a pattern by now, with people more interested in defending themselves than "reaching the truth". I'm going to lose Karma for this, but how does that differ from the long tradition of promoting a programming language as the "be all end all" when the rationalist position is that each language has benefits and disadvantages? I submit that there hasn't been much of a change. As for the lack of rhetorical skills, I cannot argue either way - I don't recall having read an article where someone accused someone else of making an ad-hominem attack (my own choice of stories differs from your own I suppose) I'll agree with you on the "productivity porn" though. Much like some local tech events (like Tokyo 2.0), there does seem to be an excess of stories where people talk about "getting things done", without necessarily the evidence of anything actually being done. Thanks for clarifying, and I hope you weren't offended at my original message.

ahoyhere 17y ago
Oh, no, I'm not offended. I was just refuting what you said because I disagree. No worries at all. You're right, the language stuff is almost exactly the same thing, except (in theory) HN people know a lot about programming languages. The education stuff, and the economic stuff, and (god forbid) the design stuff, people know practically nothing about, and rarely bother to educate themselves. People just want a forum for venting their personal opinions and promulgating their pre-existing worldviews. (In my opinion, true hackers -- the technical type, and every other type -- have fluid worldviews and don't invest much in defending their own egos in the face of conflict.) HN does not promote moderation or rationality (e.g. "everyone should use the tools that make them most effective and not argue about it"). No popularity contest can. It devolves into a place where people come to be reassured that they are, in fact, great, and the things that they are weak at are unimportant, and the things they are strong at are the most important things in the world. Metacognition disappears. Cycle: Founders: This place sucks! Let's start a new place with only the best. First Wave: This place is so much better! I can breathe free with like minds! Yay! Let's tell people about it. Second Wave: Dude this is like better than that other place. My Ruby linkbait isn't so lost in the news. Third Wave: RON PAUL!! All communities like this decay this way without very, very careful tending... and to do that careful tending, one must have an excellent understanding of social dynamics, human nature, and social skills in general. Thus all developer-centric news sites are doomed! ;)

by jbm 17y ago

ahoyhere 17y ago

Oh, no, I'm not offended. I was just refuting what you said because I disagree. No worries at all. You're right, the language stuff is almost exactly the same thing, except (in theory) HN people know a lot about programming languages. The education stuff, and the economic stuff, and (god forbid) the design stuff, people know practically nothing about, and rarely bother to educate themselves. People just want a forum for venting their personal opinions and promulgating their pre-existing worldviews. (In my opinion, true hackers -- the technical type, and every other type -- have fluid worldviews and don't invest much in defending their own egos in the face of conflict.) HN does not promote moderation or rationality (e.g. "everyone should use the tools that make them most effective and not argue about it"). No popularity contest can. It devolves into a place where people come to be reassured that they are, in fact, great, and the things that they are weak at are unimportant, and the things they are strong at are the most important things in the world. Metacognition disappears. Cycle: Founders: This place sucks! Let's start a new place with only the best. First Wave: This place is so much better! I can breathe free with like minds! Yay! Let's tell people about it. Second Wave: Dude this is like better than that other place. My Ruby linkbait isn't so lost in the news. Third Wave: RON PAUL!! All communities like this decay this way without very, very careful tending... and to do that careful tending, one must have an excellent understanding of social dynamics, human nature, and social skills in general. Thus all developer-centric news sites are doomed! ;)