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This is taking quite a scary turn, but not, I think, in the direction that the governments are intending. Rather than intimidate people into silence they are ac

This is taking quite a scary turn, but not, I think, in the direction that the governments are intending. Rather than intimidate people into silence they are actively creating a movement of people who are abhorred and appalled by these tactics. Kick that dog enough times and you're going to create an organized movement that can fight back. This is how unrest happens. What I don't think they realize is that the dog they're kicking is also the most technically capable one on the planet. They're not poking Al Qaeda with a stick, they're poking every programmer and hacker who cares about privacy with a stick. While they may have unlimited financial resources, I would pit unlimited technical resources and creativity against that any day of the week. If they manage to create an organized group of highly technical opposition I think they're going to be very surprised by how capable it is.

xradionut 13y ago
"While they may have unlimited financial resources, I would pit unlimited technical resources and creativity against that any day of the week." They are the ones with unlimited technical resources. You don't have armed drones nor biological nor nuclear weapons. You are an hostage like everyone else. You might as well accept that fact for now and just enjoy life.
- jasonkolb 13y ago
  I have to respectfully disagree. They have unlimited financial resources, which translates into unlimited storage capacity etc. But NOT (IMO) unlimited technical resources in the sense of brainpower and creativity. When I say technical resources I'm referring to the ability to create new tools. For example, I know for a fact that a large number of intelligence tools are written on top of open source projects. That base did not come from the technical resources of the government (in most cases) but rather the collective ingenuity of the hackers and programmers that built it for various reasons. You can already see projects springing up with the intent of circumventing government technical oversight. This is going to result in an endless game of technical whack-a-mole where one side is motivated by a paycheck and the other is motivated by ideals and the desire for liberty.
  - xradionut 13y ago
    I don't see "Them" ceding any power or capabilities. Nor do I see any long term solutions to this situation that don't cause worse problems in the future. Which is a shame, since there are other serious issues that will continue to be neglected till things do get really worse. Call me cynical, but I've read too much history in my life. I'm all for OSS. I believe this is going to cause a lot more people to take it and security seriously.
  - MichaelGG 13y ago
    > I know for a fact that a large number of intelligence tools are written on top of open source projects I don't see how that's really relevant, at all. Did you expect the USG to continue to use Windows instead of Linux for everything? Of course they're going to use tools available that others create. It doesn't mean they don't have unlimited resources. They can easily hire extremely intelligent and creative technical minds (we're talking about the NSA here, come on) and unfortunately, IQ does not mandate a specific political view. This was hard for me to accept, but there are some people much smarter than I am that hold very different positions on things. (Edit: To my knowledge, they are wrong, but caused by operating from different priors than I have.) You're deluding yourself if you think that somehow the only good tech people are going to be "good guys".

xradionut 13y ago

"While they may have unlimited financial resources, I would pit unlimited technical resources and creativity against that any day of the week." They are the ones with unlimited technical resources. You don't have armed drones nor biological nor nuclear weapons. You are an hostage like everyone else. You might as well accept that fact for now and just enjoy life.

jasonkolb 13y ago
I have to respectfully disagree. They have unlimited financial resources, which translates into unlimited storage capacity etc. But NOT (IMO) unlimited technical resources in the sense of brainpower and creativity. When I say technical resources I'm referring to the ability to create new tools. For example, I know for a fact that a large number of intelligence tools are written on top of open source projects. That base did not come from the technical resources of the government (in most cases) but rather the collective ingenuity of the hackers and programmers that built it for various reasons. You can already see projects springing up with the intent of circumventing government technical oversight. This is going to result in an endless game of technical whack-a-mole where one side is motivated by a paycheck and the other is motivated by ideals and the desire for liberty.
- xradionut 13y ago
  I don't see "Them" ceding any power or capabilities. Nor do I see any long term solutions to this situation that don't cause worse problems in the future. Which is a shame, since there are other serious issues that will continue to be neglected till things do get really worse. Call me cynical, but I've read too much history in my life. I'm all for OSS. I believe this is going to cause a lot more people to take it and security seriously.
- MichaelGG 13y ago
  > I know for a fact that a large number of intelligence tools are written on top of open source projects I don't see how that's really relevant, at all. Did you expect the USG to continue to use Windows instead of Linux for everything? Of course they're going to use tools available that others create. It doesn't mean they don't have unlimited resources. They can easily hire extremely intelligent and creative technical minds (we're talking about the NSA here, come on) and unfortunately, IQ does not mandate a specific political view. This was hard for me to accept, but there are some people much smarter than I am that hold very different positions on things. (Edit: To my knowledge, they are wrong, but caused by operating from different priors than I have.) You're deluding yourself if you think that somehow the only good tech people are going to be "good guys".