4 ms·

>This contradiction between user-experience and reality apparently forms the basis for many user/developers’ belief that the keyboard is faster. Interesting ar

>This contradiction between user-experience and reality apparently forms the basis for many user/developers’ belief that the keyboard is faster. Interesting article. I'm sure the $50M in studies were of non-power users, though, and so irrelevant for developers with sufficiently powerful keyboard shortcuts. I can guarantee it doesn't take me 2 seconds for my top 20 keyboard shortcuts, any more than it takes 2 seconds for me to hit "return" at the end of a line, or to move around with arrow keys. That said, I frequently use the mouse as well, and always prefer to work in a GUI instead of a text-mode editor. What I found most revealing, though, was the admission that part of the problem was the awkward location of the command key. Whenever I'm on a Mac I end up remapping it so that I can hit Control (in the corner of the keyboard) -- Control-ZXCV are all easier to hit than Command-ZXCV. Which just goes to prove that most studies are wrong [1], or at least can't always be generalized. [1] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1182327/ http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1182327/

vidarh 13y ago
> I can guarantee it doesn't take me 2 seconds for my top 20 keyboard shortcuts, From observing developers I've worked with over the years, I doubt most developers know more keyboard shortcuts than "normal people". In fact, I've come to realise just how appallingly bad most of us are at using our tools.
- SomeCallMeTim 13y ago
  >In fact, I've come to realise just how appallingly bad most of us are at using our tools. I don't disagree. I know developers who use Notepad to develop, which boggles the mind. In fact, I don't know why I bothered posting. I'm enough of an outlier in keyboard performance that, even if I'm right, it proves nothing. I've had many developers' jaws hit the floor as they watch over my shoulder. I've even shocked vi and emacs users into no longer trying to convince me their ways were better. Maybe I should teach a class on how to use a GUI efficiently.
coldtea 13y ago
>I'm sure the $50M in studies were of non-power users, though, and so irrelevant for developers with sufficiently powerful keyboard shortcuts. I can guarantee it doesn't take me 2 seconds for my top 20 keyboard shortcuts, any more than it takes 2 seconds for me to hit "return" at the end of a line, or to move around with arrow keys. Without measuring it A/B I cannot guarantee anything. Those people were just as sure. And I don't think they were keyboard un-savvy -- at that point in computing, they were far more proficient with a keyboard (AppleII etc) than a mouse.
- SomeCallMeTim 13y ago
  >Without measuring it A/B I cannot guarantee anything. You don't need to guarantee anything; I know my navigation and coding are way faster my way than if I were to ignore my shortcuts. >And I don't think they were keyboard un-savvy As a sister comment to your mentions, MOST users, even developers, are still extremely limited in the number of keyboard shortcuts they use. I'm an outlier. If I want to save, my fingers hit Ctrl-S before I could even FIND where the mouse pointer is on the screen. Same with Ctrl-A for Select All. Or Shift-Ctrl-Left for select the previous word. No A-B testing required; it's seconds using the mouse for any of those, and 300-700ms for the keyboard. And those aren't even my most powerful shortcuts; they're just the ones ANYONE can use on Windows. If you get into "complete this word from [above/below] in this file", "jump to definition of this function" or "show references for this function", or "jump to previous bookmark", or "set bookmark" even, all of these are sub-500ms key sequences that would all take longer than a second if I had to use a mouse. It's not even close. Part of the problem with the study is that it was comparing using shortcuts vs. mouse on the Mac, where shortcuts are far less useful than they are on Windows. Navigating through menus by keyboard is easier for me with the keyboard on Windows as well; that's not even an option on Mac.

vidarh 13y ago

> I can guarantee it doesn't take me 2 seconds for my top 20 keyboard shortcuts, From observing developers I've worked with over the years, I doubt most developers know more keyboard shortcuts than "normal people". In fact, I've come to realise just how appallingly bad most of us are at using our tools.

SomeCallMeTim 13y ago
>In fact, I've come to realise just how appallingly bad most of us are at using our tools. I don't disagree. I know developers who use Notepad to develop, which boggles the mind. In fact, I don't know why I bothered posting. I'm enough of an outlier in keyboard performance that, even if I'm right, it proves nothing. I've had many developers' jaws hit the floor as they watch over my shoulder. I've even shocked vi and emacs users into no longer trying to convince me their ways were better. Maybe I should teach a class on how to use a GUI efficiently.

coldtea 13y ago

>I'm sure the $50M in studies were of non-power users, though, and so irrelevant for developers with sufficiently powerful keyboard shortcuts. I can guarantee it doesn't take me 2 seconds for my top 20 keyboard shortcuts, any more than it takes 2 seconds for me to hit "return" at the end of a line, or to move around with arrow keys. Without measuring it A/B I cannot guarantee anything. Those people were just as sure. And I don't think they were keyboard un-savvy -- at that point in computing, they were far more proficient with a keyboard (AppleII etc) than a mouse.

SomeCallMeTim 13y ago
>Without measuring it A/B I cannot guarantee anything. You don't need to guarantee anything; I know my navigation and coding are way faster my way than if I were to ignore my shortcuts. >And I don't think they were keyboard un-savvy As a sister comment to your mentions, MOST users, even developers, are still extremely limited in the number of keyboard shortcuts they use. I'm an outlier. If I want to save, my fingers hit Ctrl-S before I could even FIND where the mouse pointer is on the screen. Same with Ctrl-A for Select All. Or Shift-Ctrl-Left for select the previous word. No A-B testing required; it's seconds using the mouse for any of those, and 300-700ms for the keyboard. And those aren't even my most powerful shortcuts; they're just the ones ANYONE can use on Windows. If you get into "complete this word from [above/below] in this file", "jump to definition of this function" or "show references for this function", or "jump to previous bookmark", or "set bookmark" even, all of these are sub-500ms key sequences that would all take longer than a second if I had to use a mouse. It's not even close. Part of the problem with the study is that it was comparing using shortcuts vs. mouse on the Mac, where shortcuts are far less useful than they are on Windows. Navigating through menus by keyboard is easier for me with the keyboard on Windows as well; that's not even an option on Mac.