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"Just as 2013 is the year where "ordinary people" have begun to understand that "the cloud" is a scam." Disagree. So-called "ordinary people" don't really kno

"Just as 2013 is the year where "ordinary people" have begun to understand that "the cloud" is a scam." Disagree. So-called "ordinary people" don't really know or care about this issue. They care that "hey, my phone calendar syncs with my Google calendar!". They care that "hey, I can listen to my music on my computer, my phone AND my tablet". They care that they don't have to worry about backing up some things (Google Docs / Microsoft Office 365). They care that their pictures can be accessed by their friends without having to attach them to email. No average person is running away from the cloud for this reason--they're running towards it because overall, they still feel it makes their lives easier.

Zelphyr 13y ago
This, sadly, is the ultimate truth. We may have already lost this battle for one simple reason: the average person is too apathetic to care what their Government is doing to them. Its not "By the people For the people" anymore. Its By those in power (who aren't elected, by the way) For those in power.
- mahyarm 13y ago
  When hasn't it really been like that?
  - raintrees 13y ago
    I agree. I start getting wound up, only to be gently reminded by my wife that just because I am only now discovering it for myself does not mean it hasn't been there all along...
drivingmenuts 13y ago
> So-called "ordinary people" don't really know or care about this issue. In one sense, they're right. For the most part, they really don't have anything to hide except maybe a few naughty pictures taken at a less-than-sober moment. What people don't get (and I do not claim to be an expert, just a cynic) is the ability for others to take two pieces of information and form a previously-unthought-of conclusion. They aren't mean, nasty or suspicious enough to even think that is a possibility. I still hew to the idea that this isn't a technical issue. We can come up with all kinds of secure protocols and systems until we're drowning in them but it still won't fix the problem that large parts of our society are just plain broken at some fundamental level. We passed the laws that allowed this. We hired the nosy bastards that are doing this. Hell, we made the terrorists that required us to pass the laws and hire the nosy bastards. Somewhere along the line, we decided it was more profitable to set countries on fire than it was to work on conflict resolution. We didn't need a computer to do that. Fix the philosophical issue because all the tech in the world is just a bandaid.
chris_mahan 13y ago
No, but yesterday a friend of mine asked me how to back up her pictures from her computer. I told her to use a removable drive. My wife said: "Just store them on Facebook". I said: "The US government makes a copy of anything you upload to the internet." My wife was shocked. Our friend said: "I don't want that." (She's from Hungary). We settled on 32 GB flash drives. Moral of the story: Just like Groklaw, the ordinary people will stop trusting the internet because people in the know (in her case lavabit founder) say not to trust it. Ordinary people, for the most part, trust the geeks they know to guide them through the computing landscape.
- keithpeter 13y ago
  Of course, the people who the NSA and GCHQ are trying to find and track will not be using email or other forms of electronic communication or storage for anything. It remains to be seen what happens to the general marketplace. I suspect we may see a number of startups specialising in organising face to face meetings...
- JonFish85 13y ago
  "The US government makes a copy of anything you upload to the internet" So accuracy isn't really something you're all that concerned with? It is my understanding (and certainly could be wrong) that the whole PRISM thing was the ability for the government to get their hands on any data they wished, not that they're making copies of everything. I believe metadata is stored, which is an entirely different animal.
  - chris_mahan 13y ago
    I'm just saying that "ordinary people" will follow what us geeks say, even when we're slightly wrong, because our guesses are much better than their guesses.
  - Torgo 13y ago
    It's the least untruth.
  - computer 13y ago

Zelphyr 13y ago

This, sadly, is the ultimate truth. We may have already lost this battle for one simple reason: the average person is too apathetic to care what their Government is doing to them. Its not "By the people For the people" anymore. Its By those in power (who aren't elected, by the way) For those in power.

mahyarm 13y ago
When hasn't it really been like that?
- raintrees 13y ago
  I agree. I start getting wound up, only to be gently reminded by my wife that just because I am only now discovering it for myself does not mean it hasn't been there all along...

drivingmenuts 13y ago

> So-called "ordinary people" don't really know or care about this issue. In one sense, they're right. For the most part, they really don't have anything to hide except maybe a few naughty pictures taken at a less-than-sober moment. What people don't get (and I do not claim to be an expert, just a cynic) is the ability for others to take two pieces of information and form a previously-unthought-of conclusion. They aren't mean, nasty or suspicious enough to even think that is a possibility. I still hew to the idea that this isn't a technical issue. We can come up with all kinds of secure protocols and systems until we're drowning in them but it still won't fix the problem that large parts of our society are just plain broken at some fundamental level. We passed the laws that allowed this. We hired the nosy bastards that are doing this. Hell, we made the terrorists that required us to pass the laws and hire the nosy bastards. Somewhere along the line, we decided it was more profitable to set countries on fire than it was to work on conflict resolution. We didn't need a computer to do that. Fix the philosophical issue because all the tech in the world is just a bandaid.

chris_mahan 13y ago

No, but yesterday a friend of mine asked me how to back up her pictures from her computer. I told her to use a removable drive. My wife said: "Just store them on Facebook". I said: "The US government makes a copy of anything you upload to the internet." My wife was shocked. Our friend said: "I don't want that." (She's from Hungary). We settled on 32 GB flash drives. Moral of the story: Just like Groklaw, the ordinary people will stop trusting the internet because people in the know (in her case lavabit founder) say not to trust it. Ordinary people, for the most part, trust the geeks they know to guide them through the computing landscape.

keithpeter 13y ago
Of course, the people who the NSA and GCHQ are trying to find and track will not be using email or other forms of electronic communication or storage for anything. It remains to be seen what happens to the general marketplace. I suspect we may see a number of startups specialising in organising face to face meetings...
JonFish85 13y ago
"The US government makes a copy of anything you upload to the internet" So accuracy isn't really something you're all that concerned with? It is my understanding (and certainly could be wrong) that the whole PRISM thing was the ability for the government to get their hands on any data they wished, not that they're making copies of everything. I believe metadata is stored, which is an entirely different animal.
- chris_mahan 13y ago
  I'm just saying that "ordinary people" will follow what us geeks say, even when we're slightly wrong, because our guesses are much better than their guesses.
- Torgo 13y ago
  It's the least untruth.
- computer 13y ago