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He was only 18 years old and he was speeding. Murder is a bit of a stretch.

by pfisch 13y ago

jrockway 13y ago
Actions have consequences. 18 year-olds can understand that. This wasn't a freeway where he was going 80 in a 75 zone. It was a normal road with intersections and many other road users going the speed limit or below. It's simply idiotic to drive 80 there, and it's very easy to accidentally kill someone when you're going that fast. (You have no time to react.) Driver's Ed is 6 months of you being told this every single day. He knew it was dangerous. He did it anyway. He killed someone. That's murder. (Personally, I think 40mph is way too high of a speed limit for roads like this. 20mph would be a much better. Car/pedestrian collisions are much more survivable at that speed, and cyclists can move in and out of traffic freely. But 80mph is just fucking insane.)
- jlgreco 13y ago
  He's not saying that actions don't have consequences. He isn't saying that speeding wasn't idiotic. He isn't saying that he was never provided with the opportunity to know better. He is saying that murder is a stretch.
  - James_Duval 13y ago
    If you acknowledge that actions have consequences, it follows that if you commit an action which has a high chance of causing a certain outcome (in this case, death), you are responsible for the outcome. In this case, I would say that the responsibility which this teenager has can only be called "murder".
  - tptacek 13y ago
    Again, it's only a stretch if you don't know about depraved-indifference murder. This isn't a weird loophole; it comes from common law.
lutusp 13y ago
> He was only 18 years old and he was speeding. Murder is a bit of a stretch. The reason it became murder is because he was found to be boasting about his speeding behavior online, i.e. it wasn't episodic or unintended. He meant to go fast, he planned to go fast, and an 18-year-old is an adult with adult responsibilities -- whether or not he is ready for them.
te 13y ago
If youth reduces culpability, the driving age is too low.
rosser 13y ago
No, it's not. Knowingly engaging in behavior that risky — driving faster than any posted speed limit in the entire United States of America on residential streets is egregiously risky — and thereby causing someone's death is textbook murder. EDIT: phrasing.

He was only 18 years old and he was speeding. Murder is a bit of a stretch.

by pfisch 13y ago

He was only 18 years old and he was speeding. Murder is a bit of a stretch.

Actions have consequences. 18 year-olds can understand that. This wasn't a freeway where he was going 80 in a 75 zone. It was a normal road with intersections and many other road users going the speed limit or below. It's simply idiotic to drive 80 there, and it's very easy to accidentally kill someone when you're going that fast. (You have no time to react.) Driver's Ed is 6 months of you being told this every single day. He knew it was dangerous. He did it anyway. He killed someone. That's murder. (Personally, I think 40mph is way too high of a speed limit for roads like this. 20mph would be a much better. Car/pedestrian collisions are much more survivable at that speed, and cyclists can move in and out of traffic freely. But 80mph is just fucking insane.)

jlgreco 13y ago
He's not saying that actions don't have consequences. He isn't saying that speeding wasn't idiotic. He isn't saying that he was never provided with the opportunity to know better. He is saying that murder is a stretch.
- James_Duval 13y ago
  If you acknowledge that actions have consequences, it follows that if you commit an action which has a high chance of causing a certain outcome (in this case, death), you are responsible for the outcome. In this case, I would say that the responsibility which this teenager has can only be called "murder".
- tptacek 13y ago
  Again, it's only a stretch if you don't know about depraved-indifference murder. This isn't a weird loophole; it comes from common law.

lutusp 13y ago

> He was only 18 years old and he was speeding. Murder is a bit of a stretch. The reason it became murder is because he was found to be boasting about his speeding behavior online, i.e. it wasn't episodic or unintended. He meant to go fast, he planned to go fast, and an 18-year-old is an adult with adult responsibilities -- whether or not he is ready for them.

te 13y ago

If youth reduces culpability, the driving age is too low.

rosser 13y ago

No, it's not. Knowingly engaging in behavior that risky — driving faster than any posted speed limit in the entire United States of America on residential streets is egregiously risky — and thereby causing someone's death is textbook murder. EDIT: phrasing.