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I understand that this really can be a problem in a business setting when you really want the people who are physically present to interact with each other. Th

I understand that this really can be a problem in a business setting when you really want the people who are physically present to interact with each other. This kind of argument has been going on for a while though, about how we defer attention to distant people, like answering the phone when you're already conversing with someone else, or texting under the dinner table. I've ranted about that kind of thing myself a couple times; it annoys me. (I'm ~30). But outside of business settings, it really a problem? I don't know that we can really say that in social settings it's necessarily better to be unplugged. Teenagers nowadays feel comfortable enough with their peers behaving the way this guy describes. Eventually it'll become the norm, unless somehow that same group collectively decides to behave differently. Not sure why so many people are crying foul. Unless it's because they're used to having your full attention, and now they're frustrated with having to compete with the friends you're texting/tweeting/facebooking. That's sort of narcissistic, isn't it? Do you deserve their full attention?

philwelch 17y ago
"Not sure why so many people are crying foul. Unless it's because they're used to having your full attention, and now they're frustrated with having to compete with the friends you're texting/tweeting/facebooking. That's sort of narcissistic, isn't it? Do you deserve their full attention?" If I don't deserve someone's full attention, why are we having lunch together?
- saturdayplace 17y ago
  I'm just trying to play the devil's advocate here, because honestly the behavior annoys the ever-loving crap outta me. But I think the conversation is interesting... Why are you having lunch together? To kill time? To work on a deal? To coordinate the secret drop location? Do you honestly need their full attention during lunch? What does the pause (while the other guys replies to a text/tweet) detract from lunch? Maybe context matters more than it used to.
  - smokinn 17y ago
    Personally, it doesn't bother me (I'm 25) when people do this to me (though I don't usually do it myself mostly due to not owning an iphone or ipod or any portable gadgets other than a basic cell phone) but I'm really interested in why it bothers some people. Do you know why it annoys you? Is it because you find it's a lack of respect? Is it just because you yourself have nothing better to do while your conversation partner engages with something remote?
    - saturdayplace 17y ago
      >Do you know why it annoys you? My first instinct when this happens is to say, "Pay attention to me, I'm right here." which feels narcissistic. That feeling caused me to think again about why I get annoyed. Do I really deserve their attention? The counter to the narcissism argument is that I feel like I ought to be preferred because I was there first. Sort of like how you feel when you've been waiting in line at a checkout only to have the cashier turn and answer the phone when you reach the counter. Also, I feel like physical proximity seems like it should count higher in the 'urgency' scheme.
    - frossie 17y ago
      Because it brings an imbalance in the relationship - I am giving them my full attention, and they are not. Now there are situations in which this is okay - for example in a close relationship where these things are understood, so maybe I have brought along a newspaper to read while waiting for the food to arrive, and my lunch date is checking their email. Contrary to the comment below, the narcissistic person is the one who is texting, not the one who is waiting - because the person who is texting is almost certainly overrating the importance of him sending an immediate reply to his correspondents.
    - briancooley 17y ago
      >Do you know why it annoys you? Have you ever tried to get someone's attention when they are electronically engaged? Because the electronic interaction is passive, the engaged party mistakenly believes that they can divide their attention between you and the device. They often can't. Since it's difficult to gauge how fully engaged they are, you are often left wondering whether they are actually listening to you. Trying to interact with an electronically engaged person is extremely frustrating, and I feel sorry for my wife who has tried to have many a conversation with me while I stared at a computer screen. It's fine to be together and do independent activities side-by-side, as long as that's the agreement. My wife often watches TV in the same room where I am using my laptop just for the proximity, but we never consider it quality time. In fact, I'd say those sessions often leave us feeling more urgent about spending time together. A by-product of physical proximity is evaluation of interaction. If I meet a friend for a meal or a drink, I want to interact, not gather up the leftover crumbs of attention. And, to head off an argument I've heard before, I'll say that it's not the same as if a third party dropped by during our visit. That at least has the possibility of a conversation among the three of us. I might think it rude if my friend did not introduce me, and I would certainly think it rude if my friend spent most of our time together talking to this third person without introducing me.
greggraham 17y ago
Without the ability to communicate with people all over the world, you are forced to deal with the people in your own proximity, who might not be the people you would prefer. They might not share your same interests, or they may have annoying practices. However, learning to accept, live with, and even love these people is important for human development. On the Internet, you can find an affinity group of people like yourself. You can find interesting people who may be much more knowledgable about the things you like than anyone you know locally. If you encounter someone who is annoying, you can unsubscribe or block them and find someone else more to your liking. You might even prefer the culture of another part of the world more than the one where you happen to be born. This is an old human tendancy. In the old days, if you wanted something different, you could escape with a book, but to have a dialog with different people you had to travel or immigrate, which was expensive. Even then you still had to deal with a group of neighbors and work associates that you couldn't hand pick. With the Internet, though, it is so easy and tempting to hang out with the cool people in cyberspace and avoid the difficulties of local life that it is easy to become unbalanced. The Internet is wonderful for connecting us with different cultures, the experts in any field, and distant friends and family, but I think it is important to build relationships with the people close by. They will be the ones that will help you when the power goes out.

philwelch 17y ago

"Not sure why so many people are crying foul. Unless it's because they're used to having your full attention, and now they're frustrated with having to compete with the friends you're texting/tweeting/facebooking. That's sort of narcissistic, isn't it? Do you deserve their full attention?" If I don't deserve someone's full attention, why are we having lunch together?

saturdayplace 17y ago
I'm just trying to play the devil's advocate here, because honestly the behavior annoys the ever-loving crap outta me. But I think the conversation is interesting... Why are you having lunch together? To kill time? To work on a deal? To coordinate the secret drop location? Do you honestly need their full attention during lunch? What does the pause (while the other guys replies to a text/tweet) detract from lunch? Maybe context matters more than it used to.
- smokinn 17y ago
  Personally, it doesn't bother me (I'm 25) when people do this to me (though I don't usually do it myself mostly due to not owning an iphone or ipod or any portable gadgets other than a basic cell phone) but I'm really interested in why it bothers some people. Do you know why it annoys you? Is it because you find it's a lack of respect? Is it just because you yourself have nothing better to do while your conversation partner engages with something remote?
  - saturdayplace 17y ago
    >Do you know why it annoys you? My first instinct when this happens is to say, "Pay attention to me, I'm right here." which feels narcissistic. That feeling caused me to think again about why I get annoyed. Do I really deserve their attention? The counter to the narcissism argument is that I feel like I ought to be preferred because I was there first. Sort of like how you feel when you've been waiting in line at a checkout only to have the cashier turn and answer the phone when you reach the counter. Also, I feel like physical proximity seems like it should count higher in the 'urgency' scheme.
  - frossie 17y ago
    Because it brings an imbalance in the relationship - I am giving them my full attention, and they are not. Now there are situations in which this is okay - for example in a close relationship where these things are understood, so maybe I have brought along a newspaper to read while waiting for the food to arrive, and my lunch date is checking their email. Contrary to the comment below, the narcissistic person is the one who is texting, not the one who is waiting - because the person who is texting is almost certainly overrating the importance of him sending an immediate reply to his correspondents.
  - briancooley 17y ago
    >Do you know why it annoys you? Have you ever tried to get someone's attention when they are electronically engaged? Because the electronic interaction is passive, the engaged party mistakenly believes that they can divide their attention between you and the device. They often can't. Since it's difficult to gauge how fully engaged they are, you are often left wondering whether they are actually listening to you. Trying to interact with an electronically engaged person is extremely frustrating, and I feel sorry for my wife who has tried to have many a conversation with me while I stared at a computer screen. It's fine to be together and do independent activities side-by-side, as long as that's the agreement. My wife often watches TV in the same room where I am using my laptop just for the proximity, but we never consider it quality time. In fact, I'd say those sessions often leave us feeling more urgent about spending time together. A by-product of physical proximity is evaluation of interaction. If I meet a friend for a meal or a drink, I want to interact, not gather up the leftover crumbs of attention. And, to head off an argument I've heard before, I'll say that it's not the same as if a third party dropped by during our visit. That at least has the possibility of a conversation among the three of us. I might think it rude if my friend did not introduce me, and I would certainly think it rude if my friend spent most of our time together talking to this third person without introducing me.

greggraham 17y ago

Without the ability to communicate with people all over the world, you are forced to deal with the people in your own proximity, who might not be the people you would prefer. They might not share your same interests, or they may have annoying practices. However, learning to accept, live with, and even love these people is important for human development. On the Internet, you can find an affinity group of people like yourself. You can find interesting people who may be much more knowledgable about the things you like than anyone you know locally. If you encounter someone who is annoying, you can unsubscribe or block them and find someone else more to your liking. You might even prefer the culture of another part of the world more than the one where you happen to be born. This is an old human tendancy. In the old days, if you wanted something different, you could escape with a book, but to have a dialog with different people you had to travel or immigrate, which was expensive. Even then you still had to deal with a group of neighbors and work associates that you couldn't hand pick. With the Internet, though, it is so easy and tempting to hang out with the cool people in cyberspace and avoid the difficulties of local life that it is easy to become unbalanced. The Internet is wonderful for connecting us with different cultures, the experts in any field, and distant friends and family, but I think it is important to build relationships with the people close by. They will be the ones that will help you when the power goes out.