4 ms·

Given that they used indiegogo, do they keep the funds in case the target is not hit?

tylermac1 13y ago
They chose a fixed campaign so they don't get to keep the funds. All or nothing.
mythealias 13y ago
From the webpage: This campaign will only receive funds if at least $32,000,000 is raised by its deadline. Funding duration: July 22, 2013 - August 21, 2013 (11:59pm PT)
gtmtg 13y ago
No -- it looks like they set it up as Fixed Funding (as opposed to Flexible Funding) and won't get the money unless they reach the goal.
- glennsayers 13y ago
  What's the advantage of going with Fixed Funding as opposed to Flexible? Wouldn't receiving the $8 million (or whatever it ends up at) be better than nothing?
  - eterm 13y ago
    Arguably the whole attraction of these things is that there's a model where you pledge an amount and only have to pay up if there's enough money to get it off the ground. No one wants to be the guy who stuck $700 down for something that will never exist because they were the only ones to pledge. If it weren't for the fixed model, they would struggle to get even a fraction of the money they've raised so far.
  - kryptiskt 13y ago
    There are significant fixed costs in building a smart phone, for example in design, certifications and tooling. Building something like 50K of them is already on the low end. It would be a disaster for them if they got into a position were they had costs of $1500 per phone and had to choose between bailing out or eat the losses.
karl42 13y ago
From the website: "What if you fail to reach the funding target? We appreciate every bit of support we receive during the 30 days, and every backer will be welcomed into the Ubuntu community. If we don’t reach our target then we will focus only on commercially available handsets and there will not be an Ubuntu Edge. All contributions will be fully refunded."
- Joeboy 13y ago
  Doesn't that mean they'll actually make a significant loss due to Paypal fees?
  - StavrosK 13y ago
    PayPal refunds fees when you issue a refund, so you lose nothing.
    - eterm 13y ago
      They refund fees to the client, not to the vendor iirc. This could cost indiegogo a lot.
      - StavrosK 13y ago
        When you charge $10, PayPal charges a $0.34 fee (for example) and gives you the rest. When you refund, they give the client back your cut and they refund their fees as well. Refunds are basically as if a charge never happened.
      - KamiCrit 13y ago
        Maybe this is all just a big ploy set up by Ubuntu and Paypal. Set up a $32M campaign, sure to fail, split the fees!
charlus 13y ago
On this note - does anyone know the reasons Canonical went with Indiegogo rather than Kickstarter for this? Given that it's fixed funding anyway.
- glitch003 13y ago
  Kickstarter requires hardware projects to have a working prototype, which Ubuntu does not have.

They chose a fixed campaign so they don't get to keep the funds. All or nothing.

From the webpage: This campaign will only receive funds if at least $32,000,000 is raised by its deadline. Funding duration: July 22, 2013 - August 21, 2013 (11:59pm PT)

gtmtg 13y ago

No -- it looks like they set it up as Fixed Funding (as opposed to Flexible Funding) and won't get the money unless they reach the goal.

glennsayers 13y ago
What's the advantage of going with Fixed Funding as opposed to Flexible? Wouldn't receiving the $8 million (or whatever it ends up at) be better than nothing?
- eterm 13y ago
  Arguably the whole attraction of these things is that there's a model where you pledge an amount and only have to pay up if there's enough money to get it off the ground. No one wants to be the guy who stuck $700 down for something that will never exist because they were the only ones to pledge. If it weren't for the fixed model, they would struggle to get even a fraction of the money they've raised so far.
- kryptiskt 13y ago
  There are significant fixed costs in building a smart phone, for example in design, certifications and tooling. Building something like 50K of them is already on the low end. It would be a disaster for them if they got into a position were they had costs of $1500 per phone and had to choose between bailing out or eat the losses.

karl42 13y ago

From the website: "What if you fail to reach the funding target? We appreciate every bit of support we receive during the 30 days, and every backer will be welcomed into the Ubuntu community. If we don’t reach our target then we will focus only on commercially available handsets and there will not be an Ubuntu Edge. All contributions will be fully refunded."

Joeboy 13y ago
Doesn't that mean they'll actually make a significant loss due to Paypal fees?
- StavrosK 13y ago
  PayPal refunds fees when you issue a refund, so you lose nothing.
  - eterm 13y ago
    They refund fees to the client, not to the vendor iirc. This could cost indiegogo a lot.
    - StavrosK 13y ago
      When you charge $10, PayPal charges a $0.34 fee (for example) and gives you the rest. When you refund, they give the client back your cut and they refund their fees as well. Refunds are basically as if a charge never happened.
    - KamiCrit 13y ago
      Maybe this is all just a big ploy set up by Ubuntu and Paypal. Set up a $32M campaign, sure to fail, split the fees!

charlus 13y ago

On this note - does anyone know the reasons Canonical went with Indiegogo rather than Kickstarter for this? Given that it's fixed funding anyway.

glitch003 13y ago
Kickstarter requires hardware projects to have a working prototype, which Ubuntu does not have.