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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_exceptionalism http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_exceptionalism

tareqak 13y ago
Honest question here. Isn't "American exceptionalism" the same kind of view that people of global superpowers throughout the ages would have had? "All roads lead to Rome" comes to mind, but there are probably a few others. Even the creation myths of a number of different civilizations consider the natives to be blessed somehow e.g. descended from the gods (compare this to how Americans see the Constitution and the Founding Fathers). EDIT: Actually, maybe a better example is legend of how Romulus and Remus (the founders of Rome) were raised by a she-wolf. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romulus_and_Remus https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romulus_and_Remus.
- pmjordan 13y ago
  Or atrocities committed by organised religion, even though such action is considered a horrific sin according to the same religion's scripture. (it doesn't always have to be nation states - the size of the tribe doesn't seem to matter) The justification invariably seems to be that the oppressed are inferior in some way. Belief in the wrong god, wrong skin colour, whatever. I think it's probably a fundamental mechanism in the human psyche for coping with the cognitive dissonance of the "do as I say, not as I do" attitude that seems to come naturally as a consequence of power, unless consciously, actively and continuously worked against. Maybe yet another "passing on your genes" instinct?
- johnchristopher 13y ago
  You are on to something but it seems that american exceptionalism was there from the very beginning and before it was a global superpower : From wikipedia: Jefferson envisaged America becoming the world's great "empire of liberty"--that is, the model for democracy and republicanism. He identified his nation as a beacon to the world, for, he said on departing the presidency in 1809, America was: "Trusted with the destinies of this solitary republic of the world, the only monument of human rights, and the sole depository of the sacred fire of freedom and self-government, from hence it is to be lighted up in other regions of the earth, if other regions of the earth shall ever become susceptible of its benign influence."[37] Off-topic: that wp [1] page states that american decline started at the end of the eighties. It makes an interesting read as I think the mass media put it around 9/11. Happened before 9/11 but that event crystallized that decline. [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_exceptionalism http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_exceptionalism Edit: 1. The US declared independence in 1776 and were recognized in 1783. Is 30 years between this and Jefferson statement too much to say "it was there from the beginning ?" 2. What about 1600's and 1700's US religious people and their own beliefs when they established themselves in that new promised land ? How does it relate to "American ideology, "Americanism", based on liberty, egalitarianism, individualism, republicanism, populism and laissez-faire." (from the first paragraph of that wp page) ?
  - tareqak 13y ago
    I agree that American exceptionalism was there from the very beginning, but I think that concept was used to justify a narrower set of long-term goals. Those goals changed as some were achieved and the original message being adapted in the face of new challenges. The idea seems related to start-up culture as well (think "two guys in a garage", and "we're different" as well as "war stories from back in the day" during shareholder meetings). Time will tell if setting ourselves apart sets us up for failure in the long-term.
  - deveac 13y ago
    >You are on to something but it seems that american exceptionalism was there from the very beginning and before it was a global superpower Maybe 'global superpower' wasn't a metric early America used to inform its (yet unnamed) notion of exceptionalism. Your quote from Jefferson speaks of an "empire of liberty." This could make sense if you think about it. Young America had just accomplished the almost unthinkable feat of winning independence from the Globe's biggest superpower of the time. In winning this liberty, the young nation began its life by defining itself through this hard won liberty. In a sense, America's view of what made it special might have been a response to and departure from the concept of a superpower (which it had just cast off). The characteristics he lists: >monument of human rights...freedom and self-government...it is to be lighted up in other regions of the earth if other regions of the earth shall ever become susceptible of its benign influence. His dialogue doesn't involve power or might, but rather rights and example. Even the hopeful spread of America's influence is framed as something to be willingly adopted and benign. I'm not a student of American history, so I don't know how consistent this interpretation is with the other writings and beliefs of the day, but it's really sad to me how far we've fallen from this ideal. The modern American practitioners of American Exceptionalism seem to have perverted it beyond recognition. Especially when you look at how many of these same administrations prop up dictators when it serves our perceived interests.
- deleted 13y ago
  [deleted]

Honest question here. Isn't "American exceptionalism" the same kind of view that people of global superpowers throughout the ages would have had? "All roads lead to Rome" comes to mind, but there are probably a few others. Even the creation myths of a number of different civilizations consider the natives to be blessed somehow e.g. descended from the gods (compare this to how Americans see the Constitution and the Founding Fathers). EDIT: Actually, maybe a better example is legend of how Romulus and Remus (the founders of Rome) were raised by a she-wolf. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romulus_and_Remus https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romulus_and_Remus.

pmjordan 13y ago
Or atrocities committed by organised religion, even though such action is considered a horrific sin according to the same religion's scripture. (it doesn't always have to be nation states - the size of the tribe doesn't seem to matter) The justification invariably seems to be that the oppressed are inferior in some way. Belief in the wrong god, wrong skin colour, whatever. I think it's probably a fundamental mechanism in the human psyche for coping with the cognitive dissonance of the "do as I say, not as I do" attitude that seems to come naturally as a consequence of power, unless consciously, actively and continuously worked against. Maybe yet another "passing on your genes" instinct?
johnchristopher 13y ago
You are on to something but it seems that american exceptionalism was there from the very beginning and before it was a global superpower : From wikipedia: Jefferson envisaged America becoming the world's great "empire of liberty"--that is, the model for democracy and republicanism. He identified his nation as a beacon to the world, for, he said on departing the presidency in 1809, America was: "Trusted with the destinies of this solitary republic of the world, the only monument of human rights, and the sole depository of the sacred fire of freedom and self-government, from hence it is to be lighted up in other regions of the earth, if other regions of the earth shall ever become susceptible of its benign influence."[37] Off-topic: that wp [1] page states that american decline started at the end of the eighties. It makes an interesting read as I think the mass media put it around 9/11. Happened before 9/11 but that event crystallized that decline. [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_exceptionalism http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_exceptionalism Edit: 1. The US declared independence in 1776 and were recognized in 1783. Is 30 years between this and Jefferson statement too much to say "it was there from the beginning ?" 2. What about 1600's and 1700's US religious people and their own beliefs when they established themselves in that new promised land ? How does it relate to "American ideology, "Americanism", based on liberty, egalitarianism, individualism, republicanism, populism and laissez-faire." (from the first paragraph of that wp page) ?
- tareqak 13y ago
  I agree that American exceptionalism was there from the very beginning, but I think that concept was used to justify a narrower set of long-term goals. Those goals changed as some were achieved and the original message being adapted in the face of new challenges. The idea seems related to start-up culture as well (think "two guys in a garage", and "we're different" as well as "war stories from back in the day" during shareholder meetings). Time will tell if setting ourselves apart sets us up for failure in the long-term.
- deveac 13y ago
  >You are on to something but it seems that american exceptionalism was there from the very beginning and before it was a global superpower Maybe 'global superpower' wasn't a metric early America used to inform its (yet unnamed) notion of exceptionalism. Your quote from Jefferson speaks of an "empire of liberty." This could make sense if you think about it. Young America had just accomplished the almost unthinkable feat of winning independence from the Globe's biggest superpower of the time. In winning this liberty, the young nation began its life by defining itself through this hard won liberty. In a sense, America's view of what made it special might have been a response to and departure from the concept of a superpower (which it had just cast off). The characteristics he lists: >monument of human rights...freedom and self-government...it is to be lighted up in other regions of the earth if other regions of the earth shall ever become susceptible of its benign influence. His dialogue doesn't involve power or might, but rather rights and example. Even the hopeful spread of America's influence is framed as something to be willingly adopted and benign. I'm not a student of American history, so I don't know how consistent this interpretation is with the other writings and beliefs of the day, but it's really sad to me how far we've fallen from this ideal. The modern American practitioners of American Exceptionalism seem to have perverted it beyond recognition. Especially when you look at how many of these same administrations prop up dictators when it serves our perceived interests.
deleted 13y ago
[deleted]