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I feel all that is lost today, there's less candour, less vulnerability and less elegance. As a literature major, I think you're misrepresenting the 20th centu

I feel all that is lost today, there's less candour, less vulnerability and less elegance. As a literature major, I think you're misrepresenting the 20th century; more specifically, the '50s. The '50s gave birth to the Beat poets, Kerouac's On the Road, Allen Ginsberg (who wrote poetry that would be considered pretty vulgar even by today's standards, including highly detailed sex orgies), Burroughs' Naked Lunch, etc. Basically, the '50s (and other points in the 20th century), had a lot of literature which was less elegant and less vulnerable--just as experimental as today's works of arts, just as cynical and dishonest. EB White was a purist. That doesn't mean he was any better or worse. But he does have a particular style he is partial to. There is more candid, vulnerable, and elegant literature being written today, just as there was in the late 20th century (late 90s). If you tell me the themes you're interested in, I might be able to recommend some stuff.

ender7 13y ago
Moreover, while White's style of writing is simple and straightforward, it is not representative of how people talked then (or talk today). That's part of the magic -- his words are so carefully crafted that we mistake elegance for simplicity and structure for straightforwardness. There is none of the common unevenness of natural speech to trip up our reading ears; the words flow so easily into our minds that it feels like we're talking to ourselves. White was also the co-author of a famous prescriptive book on writing and grammar [1]. He knew what he was doing :) [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Elements_of_Style https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Elements_of_Style
- kafkaesque 13y ago
  Very true! But to be honest, I'm thankful most of my English professors did not care for The Elements of Style, never recommended it, and instead recommended other style guides which were better suited to me and our times. :) I loved Charlotte's Web, though. I first read it when I was 8, I believe, and it had quite an impact on me. Thematically, quite different, but Dylan Thomas had the same, I like to call it deceptive 'straightforwardness' and 'simplicity'. Plus, his sincerity was refreshing. He stripped away all the pretentiousness that many symbolists/surrealists can be interpreted as having. When I read him I don't sense that same frivolous nature some academics have, including some stuff by EB White.
  - shadowsun7 13y ago
    Could you perhaps recommend some of these alternatives to The Elements of Style? I'm rather curious to read them and see how they compare.
    - kafkaesque 13y ago
      I'll dig through my boxes to find the one I referred to the most. I have the image of the front cover in my head, but not the name. It was something pretty generic, though. But I should clarify I went to school in Canada. All of my style guides were from small publishers and many were written by my instructors/professors. We/I did use some international ones from time to time (some profs had preferences). These were: (1) MLA Style Manual or MLA Handbook (2) AP Stylebook (3) New York Times Manual of Style and Usage (4) Chicago Manual of Style Now that I'm in the United States, I use (4) at work. They have an online version of their entire book (first 30 days free): http://www.chicagomanualofstyle.org/home.html http://www.chicagomanualofstyle.org/home.html But to get back to The Elements of Style, it would almost be easier to look at what S&W recommend and see how writers write today, as you're most likely to find the answer right there in front of you. Elements of Style was written in 1918. There have been all sorts of stylistic suggestions since then, depending on your field. The reason why we used more than one style guide at school was because neither can be said to be definitive, exhaustive or the 'best'. Some provided better explanations as to why certain styles were preferred.
eshvk 13y ago
Not the OP; I have been rather taken with the prose of Bukowski. Reminds me a lot of Naipaul. Simple, spare sentences, that are elegant. Do you have suggestions of that type? (Don't care particularly about the themes, really. )
krmmalik 13y ago
Admittedly, I'm not very well read on literature works at all, 95% of my reading has been things like modern business books. Just practical reading. There was one book I read that I really enjoyed that was done as a literature work. "The Art of Profitability". Another one was "Five dysfunctions of a team" which I'm not sure if it could be classed as a true literature work or not, not to mention the fact that the ideas hit too close to hoe at the time I was reading it and demanded a serious life change that I wasn't quite able to enjoy the work itself. I like prose that is a commentary on observations about life, man and business, if you're able to find anything. I spent about 20 minutes reading through the archives on the lettersofnote website and loved every minute of it. It was the easiest route to a super meditative state I've ever experienced. Here's one example that I really liked : http://www.lettersofnote.com/2013/06/let-us-blaze-new-trails.html http://www.lettersofnote.com/2013/06/let-us-blaze-new-trails... But that said, I'm open to varying suggestions. Thank you so much.
- kafkaesque 13y ago
  > I like prose that is a commentary on observations about life, man and business, if you're able to find anything. No idea about prose, but in terms of fiction, Death of a Salesman is the obvious one, I guess. Also, Rise of Silas Lapham, maybe? I'll be honest with you, I don't like to read books about man and life and business all in a single work. I took a few American literature courses, but none dealt with all those themes. For something completely different, have you ever read Slaughterhouse-Five?
  - krmmalik 13y ago
    Lol. I didn't mean all themes had to be in one work. Isn't death of a salesman a play? I've added slaughterhouse to my reading list. Thank you.
    - kafkaesque 13y ago
      It is a play, yes. > I didn't mean all themes had to be in one work. Oh, in that case...I can recommend so much. It'd take way too long. Here are a few, off the top of my head: The First Man by Albert Camus (novel) The Happy Prince by Oscar Wilde (short story) Waiting for Godot by Samuel Beckett (play) If you want something challenging, try Cervantes' Don Quixote.

ender7 13y ago

Moreover, while White's style of writing is simple and straightforward, it is not representative of how people talked then (or talk today). That's part of the magic -- his words are so carefully crafted that we mistake elegance for simplicity and structure for straightforwardness. There is none of the common unevenness of natural speech to trip up our reading ears; the words flow so easily into our minds that it feels like we're talking to ourselves. White was also the co-author of a famous prescriptive book on writing and grammar [1]. He knew what he was doing :) [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Elements_of_Style https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Elements_of_Style

kafkaesque 13y ago
Very true! But to be honest, I'm thankful most of my English professors did not care for The Elements of Style, never recommended it, and instead recommended other style guides which were better suited to me and our times. :) I loved Charlotte's Web, though. I first read it when I was 8, I believe, and it had quite an impact on me. Thematically, quite different, but Dylan Thomas had the same, I like to call it deceptive 'straightforwardness' and 'simplicity'. Plus, his sincerity was refreshing. He stripped away all the pretentiousness that many symbolists/surrealists can be interpreted as having. When I read him I don't sense that same frivolous nature some academics have, including some stuff by EB White.
- shadowsun7 13y ago
  Could you perhaps recommend some of these alternatives to The Elements of Style? I'm rather curious to read them and see how they compare.
  - kafkaesque 13y ago
    I'll dig through my boxes to find the one I referred to the most. I have the image of the front cover in my head, but not the name. It was something pretty generic, though. But I should clarify I went to school in Canada. All of my style guides were from small publishers and many were written by my instructors/professors. We/I did use some international ones from time to time (some profs had preferences). These were: (1) MLA Style Manual or MLA Handbook (2) AP Stylebook (3) New York Times Manual of Style and Usage (4) Chicago Manual of Style Now that I'm in the United States, I use (4) at work. They have an online version of their entire book (first 30 days free): http://www.chicagomanualofstyle.org/home.html http://www.chicagomanualofstyle.org/home.html But to get back to The Elements of Style, it would almost be easier to look at what S&W recommend and see how writers write today, as you're most likely to find the answer right there in front of you. Elements of Style was written in 1918. There have been all sorts of stylistic suggestions since then, depending on your field. The reason why we used more than one style guide at school was because neither can be said to be definitive, exhaustive or the 'best'. Some provided better explanations as to why certain styles were preferred.

eshvk 13y ago

Not the OP; I have been rather taken with the prose of Bukowski. Reminds me a lot of Naipaul. Simple, spare sentences, that are elegant. Do you have suggestions of that type? (Don't care particularly about the themes, really. )

krmmalik 13y ago

Admittedly, I'm not very well read on literature works at all, 95% of my reading has been things like modern business books. Just practical reading. There was one book I read that I really enjoyed that was done as a literature work. "The Art of Profitability". Another one was "Five dysfunctions of a team" which I'm not sure if it could be classed as a true literature work or not, not to mention the fact that the ideas hit too close to hoe at the time I was reading it and demanded a serious life change that I wasn't quite able to enjoy the work itself. I like prose that is a commentary on observations about life, man and business, if you're able to find anything. I spent about 20 minutes reading through the archives on the lettersofnote website and loved every minute of it. It was the easiest route to a super meditative state I've ever experienced. Here's one example that I really liked : http://www.lettersofnote.com/2013/06/let-us-blaze-new-trails.html http://www.lettersofnote.com/2013/06/let-us-blaze-new-trails... But that said, I'm open to varying suggestions. Thank you so much.

kafkaesque 13y ago
> I like prose that is a commentary on observations about life, man and business, if you're able to find anything. No idea about prose, but in terms of fiction, Death of a Salesman is the obvious one, I guess. Also, Rise of Silas Lapham, maybe? I'll be honest with you, I don't like to read books about man and life and business all in a single work. I took a few American literature courses, but none dealt with all those themes. For something completely different, have you ever read Slaughterhouse-Five?
- krmmalik 13y ago
  Lol. I didn't mean all themes had to be in one work. Isn't death of a salesman a play? I've added slaughterhouse to my reading list. Thank you.
  - kafkaesque 13y ago
    It is a play, yes. > I didn't mean all themes had to be in one work. Oh, in that case...I can recommend so much. It'd take way too long. Here are a few, off the top of my head: The First Man by Albert Camus (novel) The Happy Prince by Oscar Wilde (short story) Waiting for Godot by Samuel Beckett (play) If you want something challenging, try Cervantes' Don Quixote.