4 ms·

Yeah, this is called being unnecessarily combative with a cop, and is asking for some serious trouble. All you need is a cop that's at the end of a long bad day

Yeah, this is called being unnecessarily combative with a cop, and is asking for some serious trouble. All you need is a cop that's at the end of a long bad day, and eventual vindication (with a possible settlement) probably won't make up for the several months of grief. 1) Don't talk to cops 2) Don't be rude to cops lecturing the cops about your rights falls under #2. Ask if you're being detained, mention (politely!) that you only speak to cops with your attorney present if you must, and ask if you can go. Everything else in this not completely believable dialog is asking for trouble.

mindcrime 13y ago
I was never rude with him at all. Text doesn't convey tone / etc. It was actually a very cordial conversation, and he seemed genuinely interested in why somebody would adhere to such a strict stance. I could tell that he probably doesn't agree with my political stances, but that's OK. As for #2... fuck that. I'm not required to be "polite", and I'm not required to make their job easy. I'll be polite if it suits me and if they're polite to me. Otherwise, I see no reason to treat a cop like he/she is somebody special. A cop is just another douchebag with a gun and badge, IMO. Being unduly deferential / subservient to them only promotes the kind of abuses that we are constantly railing against. All you need is a cop that's at the end of a long bad day, and eventual vindication (with a possible settlement) probably won't make up for the several months of grief. That's a chance I'm perfectly willing to live with. That said, I'm 40 now, and I've been this way since I was probably 14 or so, when I got my mom pulled over because I flipped off a state trooper as we were passing by... Hell, I even flat out told one cop that he was just a glorified bean-counter, enforcing bureaucratic nonsense, and that if he really wanted to contribute to society that he should quit his job and go become a firefighter. They get huffy and annoyed, but nothing significant has ever happened. Doesn't mean a pissed off cop won't shoot me to death tomorrow, but whatever. Everything else in this not completely believable dialog is asking for trouble. Why do you say it's not completely believable? Unfortunately I don't have a recording or anything, but I promise you, that's exactly how it went down, modulo small mistakes due to my imperfect memory.
alan_cx 13y ago
Interesting. So you just forget about your rights, and accept abuse of them. You also think querying a situation is "combative"? Why use the word "lecturing"? Why not telling, or informing? Sound all a bit "do as you are told little boy, as I have a gun" to me. I suppose its consistent with US foreign policy. I suppose if the US gov expect to bully nation states around because the US has the most military power and can bomb folk back to the stone age if they don't comply, then treating its own citizens like that and expecting them to cower to the gun makes sense. As I say, it consistent at least. Gotta respect that.
- magicalist 13y ago
  What in the world? I love that you and mindcrime took "don't be rude to cops" and turned it into grovelling subservience to the police state. Let me guess, "don't be a dick" reads to you as "be fake and politically correct at all times"? Yes, we all know your type. You shouldn't be rude to cops for the same reason that you don't talk to cops: because if you catch one on a bad day who decides to charge you and then add a "resisting arrest" to the charge for fun (let alone shoot you...watch out in Oakland), you're going to have a bad time. The romance of civil disobedience might warm your heart, but the vast majority of false arrest incidents end with no compensation and no administrative action against the officer. You might get them out for a week on paid leave. Meanwhile you spent time in jail, you get your face on those mugshot sites, and all it takes is a DA waiting to make a name for themselves and suddenly you're being bankrupted in legal fees or praying to god the public defender isn't a complete moron. All because the cop asked you if he could search your car and you decided that a simple "no" would be "cowering to the gun" because you're fucking Robin Hood. Congratulations. You sound like you're not in the US, but if you'd like to learn more, watch the don't talk to police[1] video. For people that are in the US (and aren't merely engaging in the intellectually laziest of solipsisms like the above), remember to always refuse a search and ask if you're being detained. If not, leave immediately. If so, tell them that you won't be speaking again until an attorney is present. If you think "informing" the cop of your rights is a good idea in that moment, watch the video again. Don't talk to the police. [1] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wXkI4t7nuc http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wXkI4t7nuc
  - 13y ago

mindcrime 13y ago

I was never rude with him at all. Text doesn't convey tone / etc. It was actually a very cordial conversation, and he seemed genuinely interested in why somebody would adhere to such a strict stance. I could tell that he probably doesn't agree with my political stances, but that's OK. As for #2... fuck that. I'm not required to be "polite", and I'm not required to make their job easy. I'll be polite if it suits me and if they're polite to me. Otherwise, I see no reason to treat a cop like he/she is somebody special. A cop is just another douchebag with a gun and badge, IMO. Being unduly deferential / subservient to them only promotes the kind of abuses that we are constantly railing against. All you need is a cop that's at the end of a long bad day, and eventual vindication (with a possible settlement) probably won't make up for the several months of grief. That's a chance I'm perfectly willing to live with. That said, I'm 40 now, and I've been this way since I was probably 14 or so, when I got my mom pulled over because I flipped off a state trooper as we were passing by... Hell, I even flat out told one cop that he was just a glorified bean-counter, enforcing bureaucratic nonsense, and that if he really wanted to contribute to society that he should quit his job and go become a firefighter. They get huffy and annoyed, but nothing significant has ever happened. Doesn't mean a pissed off cop won't shoot me to death tomorrow, but whatever. Everything else in this not completely believable dialog is asking for trouble. Why do you say it's not completely believable? Unfortunately I don't have a recording or anything, but I promise you, that's exactly how it went down, modulo small mistakes due to my imperfect memory.

alan_cx 13y ago

Interesting. So you just forget about your rights, and accept abuse of them. You also think querying a situation is "combative"? Why use the word "lecturing"? Why not telling, or informing? Sound all a bit "do as you are told little boy, as I have a gun" to me. I suppose its consistent with US foreign policy. I suppose if the US gov expect to bully nation states around because the US has the most military power and can bomb folk back to the stone age if they don't comply, then treating its own citizens like that and expecting them to cower to the gun makes sense. As I say, it consistent at least. Gotta respect that.

magicalist 13y ago
What in the world? I love that you and mindcrime took "don't be rude to cops" and turned it into grovelling subservience to the police state. Let me guess, "don't be a dick" reads to you as "be fake and politically correct at all times"? Yes, we all know your type. You shouldn't be rude to cops for the same reason that you don't talk to cops: because if you catch one on a bad day who decides to charge you and then add a "resisting arrest" to the charge for fun (let alone shoot you...watch out in Oakland), you're going to have a bad time. The romance of civil disobedience might warm your heart, but the vast majority of false arrest incidents end with no compensation and no administrative action against the officer. You might get them out for a week on paid leave. Meanwhile you spent time in jail, you get your face on those mugshot sites, and all it takes is a DA waiting to make a name for themselves and suddenly you're being bankrupted in legal fees or praying to god the public defender isn't a complete moron. All because the cop asked you if he could search your car and you decided that a simple "no" would be "cowering to the gun" because you're fucking Robin Hood. Congratulations. You sound like you're not in the US, but if you'd like to learn more, watch the don't talk to police[1] video. For people that are in the US (and aren't merely engaging in the intellectually laziest of solipsisms like the above), remember to always refuse a search and ask if you're being detained. If not, leave immediately. If so, tell them that you won't be speaking again until an attorney is present. If you think "informing" the cop of your rights is a good idea in that moment, watch the video again. Don't talk to the police. [1] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wXkI4t7nuc http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wXkI4t7nuc
- 13y ago