8 ms·

It's impossible because Mozilla won't work with Google, not because it's actually impossible.

by pbsdp 13y ago

gnaritas 13y ago
Even if they did, that's not enough, you have to get it into all popular browsers, not just two. JavaScript works everywhere, you have to match that to have any hope of replacing it.
- pbsdp 13y ago
  Two browsers is more than enough to shift the industry, and there's still nothing stopping you from supporting JS as a legacy compilation target.
  - gnaritas 13y ago
    No it isn't; if you can't get Microsoft and Apple on board, it won't shift. It'll take more than Mozilla and Google cooperating to replace JS.
    - pbsdp 13y ago
      Ah, so it will lose because it will lose. So we can't implement it because we won't implement it. That's ridiculous. Mozilla is willing to stick their neck out there implementing a mobile phone operating system, but trying to deploy a sane runtime environment to replace JavaScript is just too risky?
      - gnaritas 13y ago
        It is ridiculous, but it's also reality.
        pbsdp 13y ago
        It's reality because Mozilla makes it a reality. See how this is a circular argument? Meanwhile, native mobile and desktop keep growing, and growing, and the web as an application platform loses out, because none of the native platform vendors are quibbling about whether they can convince themselves to ever do something different than what they were doing before.
        gnaritas 13y ago
        > Mozilla makes it a reality No, the situation makes it a reality; Mozilla doesn't control Apple or Microsoft.
        pbsdp 13y ago
        That didn't stop them from trying to launch a mobile phone platform in competition with Apple, Microsoft, and Google. If they're willing to accept that risk, by comparison, how large of a risk is trying to push through a better standardized browser execution environment, with Google's cooperation? God forbid they succeed, and we finally have a competitive application platform.
        gnaritas 13y ago
        I see; you're the type who thinks he's smarter than everyone in the industry and just has all the answers and ignores anything that doesn't fit your idea. Never mind that no one has been able to replace JS, just listen to you and all those problems will evaporate. Goodbye.
        pbsdp 13y ago
        > I see; you're the type who thinks he's smarter than everyone in the industry ... You mean, like Google, who continually pushes to do exactly what I've described here, only to be stymied by: - Apple, who has no reason to support the web as competitive to their native platform. - Microsoft, same. - Mozilla, who refuses to consider that there might be a world beyond HTML/CSS/JS because they believe those specific technologies are intrinsic qualities of the web, and thus central to their mission of supporting the web. Looks like the only people I disagree with are the Mozilla camp. Microsoft and Apple have different priorities, and Google is continually frustrated by exactly what I've described here.

It's impossible because Mozilla won't work with Google, not because it's actually impossible.

by pbsdp 13y ago

It's impossible because Mozilla won't work with Google, not because it's actually impossible.

Even if they did, that's not enough, you have to get it into all popular browsers, not just two. JavaScript works everywhere, you have to match that to have any hope of replacing it.

pbsdp 13y ago
Two browsers is more than enough to shift the industry, and there's still nothing stopping you from supporting JS as a legacy compilation target.
- gnaritas 13y ago
  No it isn't; if you can't get Microsoft and Apple on board, it won't shift. It'll take more than Mozilla and Google cooperating to replace JS.
  - pbsdp 13y ago
    Ah, so it will lose because it will lose. So we can't implement it because we won't implement it. That's ridiculous. Mozilla is willing to stick their neck out there implementing a mobile phone operating system, but trying to deploy a sane runtime environment to replace JavaScript is just too risky?
    - gnaritas 13y ago
      It is ridiculous, but it's also reality.
      - pbsdp 13y ago
        It's reality because Mozilla makes it a reality. See how this is a circular argument? Meanwhile, native mobile and desktop keep growing, and growing, and the web as an application platform loses out, because none of the native platform vendors are quibbling about whether they can convince themselves to ever do something different than what they were doing before.
        gnaritas 13y ago
        > Mozilla makes it a reality No, the situation makes it a reality; Mozilla doesn't control Apple or Microsoft.
        pbsdp 13y ago
        That didn't stop them from trying to launch a mobile phone platform in competition with Apple, Microsoft, and Google. If they're willing to accept that risk, by comparison, how large of a risk is trying to push through a better standardized browser execution environment, with Google's cooperation? God forbid they succeed, and we finally have a competitive application platform.
        gnaritas 13y ago
        I see; you're the type who thinks he's smarter than everyone in the industry and just has all the answers and ignores anything that doesn't fit your idea. Never mind that no one has been able to replace JS, just listen to you and all those problems will evaporate. Goodbye.
        pbsdp 13y ago
        > I see; you're the type who thinks he's smarter than everyone in the industry ... You mean, like Google, who continually pushes to do exactly what I've described here, only to be stymied by: - Apple, who has no reason to support the web as competitive to their native platform. - Microsoft, same. - Mozilla, who refuses to consider that there might be a world beyond HTML/CSS/JS because they believe those specific technologies are intrinsic qualities of the web, and thus central to their mission of supporting the web. Looks like the only people I disagree with are the Mozilla camp. Microsoft and Apple have different priorities, and Google is continually frustrated by exactly what I've described here.