5 ms·

What do you think his intention is, to do the right thing? He knows what he's doing and there's no reason to expect him to acknowledge the "side-effects" of an

What do you think his intention is, to do the right thing? He knows what he's doing and there's no reason to expect him to acknowledge the "side-effects" of an evil regulation. And the reporter is not responsible for realizing this; you are.

pyre 13y ago
So the reporter has no responsibility to uphold journalistic ideals? Good to know.
- EarthLaunch 13y ago
  I'm glad I was able to educate you without either of us resorting to sarcasm.
  - pyre 13y ago
    The problem with this thread is that it's entirely possible to read it as both my post and your reply are sarcastic, or they both aren't. If you really require me to be explicit, I can spell it out for you: * Each person has an individual responsibility to realize such things for their self via critical thinking. * A reporter has no legal responsibility to uphold journalistic principals. * A reporter should have an ethical responsibility to uphold journalistic principals. This, to me, is the equivalent of victim-blaming: You walk past a dark alley and see someone being assaulted. You are under no legal obligation to help the person, therefore you do not help the person. The person has no right to be angry at you because they should have been responsible for *their own* safety and shouldn't rely on anyone else. The person being assaulted is the person that is *really* at fault because they failed to protect their own personal safety.
    - EarthLaunch 13y ago
      If you wanted to have a serious conversation about journalistic integrity, you would not begin with sarcasm and continue with condescension. That's why you didn't deserve a serious reply, and still don't. The entire thread you started is also off-topic and as worthwhile as your thoughts in it.
      - pyre 13y ago
        In your original post, you stated that it was the reader's responsibility to do the critical thinking necessary to realize that the censorship controls could be used for 'evil.' This view implies that people without the requisite critical thinking skills are irresponsible, and therefore deserve what they get[1]. [1] Couldn't think of a better way of putting it. I'm not saying that you're stating that sentiment directly.
        eyko 13y ago
        His view also fails to acknowledge the fact that press is not either cheap propaganda / sensationalism, versus well written and researched articles. There are also well written and researched manipulative articles that even a reader with good enough critical thinking skills might be mislead by. It's easy to blame the reader when what you read is "too good to be true" or "so obvious that it's not", but when a fabrication makes its way into a rather respected journal, or when a more or less respected author gets something unusually wrong (which you're not clever enough to spot because it's not your expertise), then one can't be blamed to have believed it in the first place.
      - lttlrck 13y ago
        You started the conversation with statement that arguably defends shoddy journalism. Instead of backing it up, you claim the response to your comment is off-topic and proclaim offense at sarcasm and condescension (both useful devices for eliciting emotional responses in debate...). How about taking the high road?
- willyt 13y ago
  There's a whole seperate article in the opinion section on why the law doesn't make sense http://m.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2013/jul/21/david-cameron-war-internet-porn http://m.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2013/jul/21/david-came... The 'quality' UK papers generally try to seperate opinions from factual reporting. Maybe the NYT WSJ etc do this as well?
  - GeneralMayhem 13y ago
    There are plenty of criticisms of this law that are perfectly factual, like "Cameron doesn't have a God damn idea how the Internet works," or "No censorship scheme on the Internet has ever remained effective against the dedicated for more than a few minutes," or "Cameron has entirely failed to describe what he means by 'violent pornography' in a way that is specific enough to be legally actionable or differentiable from pornography/the Web in general." Not including any such facts in the main article is dishonest.
rmc 13y ago
What do you think his intention is, to do the right thing? Win votes. That's the definition of success in politics.

pyre 13y ago

So the reporter has no responsibility to uphold journalistic ideals? Good to know.

EarthLaunch 13y ago
I'm glad I was able to educate you without either of us resorting to sarcasm.
- pyre 13y ago
  The problem with this thread is that it's entirely possible to read it as both my post and your reply are sarcastic, or they both aren't. If you really require me to be explicit, I can spell it out for you: * Each person has an individual responsibility to realize such things for their self via critical thinking. * A reporter has no legal responsibility to uphold journalistic principals. * A reporter should have an ethical responsibility to uphold journalistic principals. This, to me, is the equivalent of victim-blaming: You walk past a dark alley and see someone being assaulted. You are under no legal obligation to help the person, therefore you do not help the person. The person has no right to be angry at you because they should have been responsible for *their own* safety and shouldn't rely on anyone else. The person being assaulted is the person that is *really* at fault because they failed to protect their own personal safety.
  - EarthLaunch 13y ago
    If you wanted to have a serious conversation about journalistic integrity, you would not begin with sarcasm and continue with condescension. That's why you didn't deserve a serious reply, and still don't. The entire thread you started is also off-topic and as worthwhile as your thoughts in it.
    - pyre 13y ago
      In your original post, you stated that it was the reader's responsibility to do the critical thinking necessary to realize that the censorship controls could be used for 'evil.' This view implies that people without the requisite critical thinking skills are irresponsible, and therefore deserve what they get[1]. [1] Couldn't think of a better way of putting it. I'm not saying that you're stating that sentiment directly.
      - eyko 13y ago
        His view also fails to acknowledge the fact that press is not either cheap propaganda / sensationalism, versus well written and researched articles. There are also well written and researched manipulative articles that even a reader with good enough critical thinking skills might be mislead by. It's easy to blame the reader when what you read is "too good to be true" or "so obvious that it's not", but when a fabrication makes its way into a rather respected journal, or when a more or less respected author gets something unusually wrong (which you're not clever enough to spot because it's not your expertise), then one can't be blamed to have believed it in the first place.
    - lttlrck 13y ago
      You started the conversation with statement that arguably defends shoddy journalism. Instead of backing it up, you claim the response to your comment is off-topic and proclaim offense at sarcasm and condescension (both useful devices for eliciting emotional responses in debate...). How about taking the high road?
willyt 13y ago
There's a whole seperate article in the opinion section on why the law doesn't make sense http://m.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2013/jul/21/david-cameron-war-internet-porn http://m.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2013/jul/21/david-came... The 'quality' UK papers generally try to seperate opinions from factual reporting. Maybe the NYT WSJ etc do this as well?
- GeneralMayhem 13y ago
  There are plenty of criticisms of this law that are perfectly factual, like "Cameron doesn't have a God damn idea how the Internet works," or "No censorship scheme on the Internet has ever remained effective against the dedicated for more than a few minutes," or "Cameron has entirely failed to describe what he means by 'violent pornography' in a way that is specific enough to be legally actionable or differentiable from pornography/the Web in general." Not including any such facts in the main article is dishonest.

rmc 13y ago

What do you think his intention is, to do the right thing? Win votes. That's the definition of success in politics.