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I don't like abusive comments at all, and I'm sure that an abrasive environment will keep some good hackers away. On the other hand, I'm also sure that an envi

I don't like abusive comments at all, and I'm sure that an abrasive environment will keep some good hackers away. On the other hand, I'm also sure that an environment where you always need to bite your tongue and force yourself to be very polite, even when you're pissed off, would keep other good hackers away. Especially among those that do this for passion, and not because they're paid to.

DanBC 13y ago
I'm always baffled by this response. There are many ways to tell someone that they are wrong without calling them a fucking idiot or without having to bite your tongue and forcing yourself to be very polite.
- danmaz74 13y ago
  The thing is that there will always be people who have different thresholds for what is abusive, what is polite, etc. For example, here in Rome swearing is very common and isn't usually considered abusive if it isn't directed to a the person. Example: "For fucks sake, why the hell did you name that variable X instead of Y, as our naming conventions say?" is not polite, but it's a critic directed at what you did, not what you are. On the other hand "I'm beginning to think that you're never going to be able to follow our naming conventions. You probably just aren't good enough" sounds polite, but it's really a demeaning personal attack. What's more abusive?
  - talmand 13y ago
    Between your two examples, the second one is by far more demeaning. Cursing is not always an example of being demeaning to another person. Your first example has two curses in it, to some just one, but they weren't directly aimed at the person being spoken to. That's just being rude by using language that many people may not like to hear in a public space. If your first example was an abrasive comment directed at the person, such as "You are a fucking idiot because you can't follow simple naming conventions that a slightly trained monkey could follow!", then it would be demeaning towards that person. I would also say that your second example isn't exactly polite either.
    - danmaz74 13y ago
      Between your two examples, the second one is by far more demeaning. Exactly. Being "professional" and being respectful are almost orthogonal.

DanBC 13y ago

I'm always baffled by this response. There are many ways to tell someone that they are wrong without calling them a fucking idiot or without having to bite your tongue and forcing yourself to be very polite.

danmaz74 13y ago
The thing is that there will always be people who have different thresholds for what is abusive, what is polite, etc. For example, here in Rome swearing is very common and isn't usually considered abusive if it isn't directed to a the person. Example: "For fucks sake, why the hell did you name that variable X instead of Y, as our naming conventions say?" is not polite, but it's a critic directed at what you did, not what you are. On the other hand "I'm beginning to think that you're never going to be able to follow our naming conventions. You probably just aren't good enough" sounds polite, but it's really a demeaning personal attack. What's more abusive?
- talmand 13y ago
  Between your two examples, the second one is by far more demeaning. Cursing is not always an example of being demeaning to another person. Your first example has two curses in it, to some just one, but they weren't directly aimed at the person being spoken to. That's just being rude by using language that many people may not like to hear in a public space. If your first example was an abrasive comment directed at the person, such as "You are a fucking idiot because you can't follow simple naming conventions that a slightly trained monkey could follow!", then it would be demeaning towards that person. I would also say that your second example isn't exactly polite either.
  - danmaz74 13y ago
    Between your two examples, the second one is by far more demeaning. Exactly. Being "professional" and being respectful are almost orthogonal.