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I don't know… suppose some highly advanced aliens with for the most part benign intent found us. Would you really like them to "stay the fuck away"? I, for one,

I don't know… suppose some highly advanced aliens with for the most part benign intent found us. Would you really like them to "stay the fuck away"? I, for one, would love for our technology to leapfrog ahead centuries, even though it would completely change our culture. The disease part can be handled today. We could go visit them in hazmat suits. And I know I'm being really generous when I'm comparing the modern world to benign aliens, but properly managed (as access to the island already appears to be) surely we can approach them in a decent way? That they violently defend themselves is of course a highly complicating factor. I guess all I'm saying is that not establishing contact is also a choice that we're making on their behalf. Is deciding that they can't parttake in modern society any more OK than deciding they must? Can we not contact them in a way where they get to choose? Edit: I certainly agree that we as humans have an absolutely horrible track record on these kinds of things. But it's been a while now, hasn't it? Can't we pull this off by now? These guys are our brothers and sisters - should we at least not have a chat with them to see if they really want to be left the fuck alone, or if they might want to not die whenever they get an infected wound, or half the time they have kids, or whenever they break a leg? Hell, it might well be that some of them want to be left the fuck alone, while some would like to see the world. How come those latter ones have to stay on that island just because we say so?

loxs 13y ago
Regarding the aliens... how do we know they aren't already doing exactly that to us? "Leave them alone"? Also, with advanced technology comes advanced ways of self destruction. Maybe we don't poses the cultural requirements for being accepted in that club? I would argue the same for the Sentinese (there are good historical examples for this[1]). Maybe if we give them weapons, they will kill themselves, or end up in constant warring state or something else. [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingdom_of_Tahiti http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingdom_of_Tahiti
userulluipeste 13y ago
The (Star Trek's) Prime Directive is not something worthwhile to be considered here? The representatives of these people (the ones with bows and other kind of weapons that dare to face the outsiders) are stating clearly their policy. Maybe it is us that must get over our desires to intrude supposedly on someone else's benefit.
- Anderkent 13y ago
  The representatives of these people are hardly in a situation where they can make an informed decision. Even if they were, they have no right of condemning their children to such life.
  - userulluipeste 13y ago
    We are getting into politics here. We all have representatives and policy makers that are deciding all the time for us and we also have to support the consequences of their decisions, no mater how informed they were.
  - annnnd 13y ago
    That doesn't really matter. If a girl refuses to go out with you, she might not be in a position where she can make an informed decision. And she is possibly depriving her future children of a magnificent father, condemning them to life without you. But you should still respect her "NO". On a more serious note, given some historic evidence how our contact with other tribes ended (pick any tribe, anytime, anywhere) I am both surprised and happy that they exist. I hope they stay the same for as long as possible and may we never learn anything about them.
    - Anderkent 13y ago
      But if a man is jumping of a cliff because he thinks he can fly, you should not respect his 'NO' when trying to catch him. Your serious argument is one of the little valid points raised so far. And I agree, we might not be in a position to help them now. But the statements that even if we could bring them to our society in a humane manner we still shouldn't, because they're clearly fine as they are... That just disgusts me.
      - ctdonath 13y ago
        They're not jumping off a cliff. They've been doing fine (insofar as they're surviving with a small population) for some 60 thousand years. First contact alone will probably kill them with diseases (a well-documented phenomenon). More akin to a guy standing on a ledge of a cliff, albeit precarious but doing fine; if you try to help him, he'll probably fall and die fast. He knows this, and he's telling you to stay the he11 away. That said, I am sympathetic with your basic view. Les Stroud's Beyond Survival was fascinating, but the recurring theme of "and this ancient people is about to die out or lose their culture" struck me as "well, if doing stupid things[1] isn't survivable then maybe those ways should change, and the consequences of sticking to them are natural." The Sentinese however seem to be holding it together pretty well; not advancing, but living on what is otherwise a stereotypical tropical paradise island (food growing on trees, good climate, water), methinks they've achieved some form of comfortable equilibrium and are doing pretty well (I'm sure some here on HN are thinking "I'd like to join them"). Someone mentioned above "your 100 kids will leave the island, move to India, and become call center employees". That vs. where & how they're living now, I'm not so sure "bring[ing] them to our society in a humane manner" really is. Someday it will happen, someday modern life will crash into their ancient and stable culture, someday they will have to deal with new diseases and cell phones and high-speed transport, and "someday" probably isn't very long from now. "But the kids need to do X and Y and Z!" my wife declares. "They're content and playing nicely with their toys and crayons," I'll reply. "Let them enjoy it a little longer." [1] - the clincher was a tribe that fishes by dangling bare hooks in the ocean for hours while sitting on poles. I'm amazed that culture lasted so long. Yeah, they need some help.
Shivetya 13y ago
Considering the state of our affairs, I think we are doing them best by not interfering in their way of life.
prof_hobart 13y ago
> I guess all I'm saying is that not establishing contact is also a choice that we're making on their behalf. It's also a choice that they are making for themselves. It may or may not be a fully informed choice, but they are making their opinions pretty clear. They certainly aren't coming across as a group of people looking desperately to some outside group to save them from anything.
geuis 13y ago
Answer 1: Yes, stay the fuck away. If Race XYZ has ability to monitor us without us knowing, thus not interfering with us, sure go ahead. Its not like there's much we could to stop them. But the moment they make their existence known, we're fucked. At that moment, we aren't the world-conquering successful species we love and proclaim to be. We're the little tribe living on the little island that's quietly being protected by the corrupt government of a minor power in the universal state of nations and empires that we just are now learning about. There's a lot of euphemisms in my last few sentences. Figure them out. Leave these people alone. This is kind of in response to your second point. Think about the scale of what we're talking about. We have a massively global, interconnected society of both economy and knowledge comprising billions of people. Even the poorest person in the most desolate parts of the world can, with some inconvenience, get on to the Internet. The people on this island, 400-1000 souls that they be, don't even have the understanding of modern society that the poorest person in the modern world has. Where do you start with that? So suppose your friendly aliens show up and say "Hi!". What then? We're the people that struggle to maintain ONE space station. We have no extra-terrestrial colonies or establishments. Aliens decide to claim Mars? What are we going to do? The Moon? Its theirs. Pretty much anything outside of our little island Earth is open for claim, and not by us necessarily. The fucked up part is that if you traveled tens or hundreds of light years to get here, Earth itself is probably not the main goal. Its just the natural resources of the system. And what happens in a few hundred years when we decide to get off our asses and go into space? Nothing's left, because fucking Zork claimed it all. So when you think about all of this together, what options do you present to these people even if they were interested? Medicine, food? Sure. Maybe we can get them vaccinated before the common cold or bird flu wipes them out. Education? Here's some books representing external human history from the perspective of the people supplying the money. Oh, check out our religion too! By the way, did you know that your island is one of several others claimed by India? Its a big island (not really) with over 1 billion people. Too many to count? Don't worry, once your 100 kids have moved to Bangalore to become tech support reps and within 20 years your entire culture has died they'll be able to explain. I know this is a bit rambly, but hopefully you can see where I'm going. There is no benefit to the people in question to be contacted by us. It only changes and hurts them.
- precisioncoder 13y ago
rapind 13y ago
Considering they have no marketable skills or education, how could their situation get any better? There are tons of poor people in the world who die from easily preventable diseases that you could help instead if that's your true motivation. They are a self-sufficient people that don't seem to be screwing up the world nearly as much as we are... why would we even assume we're superior? Maybe we're just jealous?
- gotrythis 13y ago
  Exactly!!!! They are superior in that they are sustainable, and it's so horrible that people want to convert them into us. Let's build them a Walmart while we're at it.
- s_q_b 13y ago
  Personally I like refrigeration, modern medicine, transportation, and high technology. Maybe those aren't your thing, but I know if I was born into a society like that, I would spend my life trying to see what was beyond the water. Or die. Because, you know, a lot of them die.
  - freyr 13y ago
    We all die.
    - chronic25 13y ago
      They die sooner.
    - johnchristopher 13y ago
      I am pretty sure parent wanted to point out that we live much longer.
  - rapind 13y ago
    Life's good when you're at the top of the totem poll. However, if the greener grass turns out to be a Mumbai slum or an e-waste site in China, or one of many other terrible but more realistic fates, maybe you'd pass on that opportunity... because, you know, a lot of people die there too.
3327 13y ago
Ehm, Isn't their violent reaction a clear representation of their choice? Individuals might want to get out and wonder as you say, but some makes a choice for them - their leaders. For one reason or another good or bad. Just like people make choices for you and you have bare minimum say. They way your government, state government, mayor they all make choices that impact your life one way or another, some highly, some to a low degree. >I guess all I'm saying is that not establishing contact is also a choice that we're making on their behalf. Is deciding that they can't parttake in modern society any more OK than deciding they must? Can we not contact them in a way where they get to choose? so NO!
sampo 13y ago
One one hand: Most of the Australian aborigine people had walked out of the desert by the 1960's, but in 1984 a family of 9 that had lived in the desert, finally also walked out to reunite with their relatives [1]. The relatives had already lived ca. 20 years in an Australian village nearby. When they finally saw the comfortable lifestyle their relatives had enjoyed already for 20 years, they were quite angry [2] that they had been left living in the desert, and not contacted earlier: "They told us there was plenty of food and water came out of pipes," Yardi said. "The older ones were angry that their long-lost relatives – who they had not seen for nearly 20 years – had left them out in the desert eating lizards while they lived in what they saw as the lap of luxury," "I like this life," Yardi said. "I much prefer it to the old ways." Warlinipirri said: "I wouldn't go back." [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pintupi_Nine http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pintupi_Nine [2] http://www.heraldsun.com.au/archive/news/lost-tribe-happy-in-modern-world/story-e6frf7l6-1111112932308 http://www.heraldsun.com.au/archive/news/lost-tribe-happy-in...
- sampo 13y ago
  On the other hand: The Sentinelese people (of the article) are not the only indigenous people around there, they are just on the most distant island. On nearby larger islands there live e.g. the Jarawa [1] and Onge [2] people and some others [3]. The Jawara inhabit jungle areas of a larger island, that has also for already very long time been settled by Indian farmers. The Jarawa used to stay in the jungle, and there were occasional violent encounter and conflicts. But in 1997 the Jarawa started to make peaceful visits to nearby villages, wanting food and gifts. The farmers see the Jarawa as a nuisance. They don't want to escalate violence, but they also don't want the Jarawa to learn that they could walk in people's homes and steal whatever they want. Apparently [4,5] the Jarawa and Onge languages are not very well studied, either. So, whatever anthropological, cultural and humanitarian interest anyone might have toward the un-contacted people on the North Sentinel island, they could first direct their interest and charity toward these other nearby tribes who have already had some contact with civilization for last decades or centuries, but are apparently not faring very well at the moment. [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jarawa_people_%28Andaman_Islands%29 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jarawa_people_%28Andaman_Island... [2] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Onge_people http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Onge_people [3] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andaman_Islands#Indigenous_Andamanese http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andaman_Islands#Indigenous_Anda... [4] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jarawa_language_%28Andaman_Islands%29 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jarawa_language_%28Andaman_Isla... [5] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Onge_language http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Onge_language
bobbydavid 13y ago
one thing about the western world, and America especially: we have no cultural memory of what it feels like to have another culture impose their value system upon you. it's therefore easy to see other cultural views as falling into these categories: odd/silly, needlessly restrictive (possibly also immoral), or downright immoral [1]. that's a mental trap, though, much like believing yourself to live at the center of the universe. once you remove the "superior culture" argument, it becomes quite hard to formulating a reason to touch this island. for instance: we have medicine! but we only value it because we fear death, etc. [1] examples come to mind: some cultures believe using birth control is like murder (silly). some cultures believe a woman should not exposition her shoulders in public (no rights). some cultures believe infanticide is acceptable, others find it natural for men to have romantic relationships with boys (immoral). these are all examples from a western perspective, of course.
- rtpg 13y ago
  >for instance: we have medicine! but we only value it because we fear death, etc. I could understand that argument when considering prolonging of life when you're already really old and pretty much falling apart, but for completely preventable deaths? I remember reading somewhere that a cult of death is considered a pretty universal value.
bobbydavid 13y ago
one thing about the western world, and America especially: we have no cultural memory of what it feels like to have another culture impose their value system upon you. it's therefore easy to see other cultural views as falling into these categories: odd/silly, needlessly restrictive (possibly also immoral), or downright immoral [1]. that's a mental trap, though, much like believing yourself to live at the center of the universe. once you remove the "superior culture" argument, it becomes quite hard to formulating a reason to touch this island. for instance: we have medicine! but we only value it because we fear death, etc. [1] examples come to mind: some cultures believe using birth control is like murder (silly). some cultures believe a woman should not exposition her shoulders in public (no rights). some cultures believe infanticide is acceptable, others find it natural for men to have romantic relationships with boys (immoral). these are all examples from a western perspective, of course.
deleted 13y ago
[deleted]
anigbrowl 13y ago
That they violently defend themselves is of course a highly complicating factor. I feel that this is a choice of theirs that should be respected rather than considered as an inconvenient obstacle. True, it's an ignorant choice, but nothing is preventing them taking a more curious stance.
gambler 13y ago
I guess all I'm saying is that not establishing contact is also a choice that we're making on their behalf. Assimilating a culture is an irreversible action. Once it's assimilated, there is no going back. Once we assimilate everyone on the planet, there will be no enclaves. Nothing to learn or wonder about. Is it not scary? To be a complete monoculture? If everyone on Earth could join advanced aliens any time, could Earth be considered an independent society?

loxs 13y ago

Regarding the aliens... how do we know they aren't already doing exactly that to us? "Leave them alone"? Also, with advanced technology comes advanced ways of self destruction. Maybe we don't poses the cultural requirements for being accepted in that club? I would argue the same for the Sentinese (there are good historical examples for this[1]). Maybe if we give them weapons, they will kill themselves, or end up in constant warring state or something else. [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingdom_of_Tahiti http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingdom_of_Tahiti

userulluipeste 13y ago

The (Star Trek's) Prime Directive is not something worthwhile to be considered here? The representatives of these people (the ones with bows and other kind of weapons that dare to face the outsiders) are stating clearly their policy. Maybe it is us that must get over our desires to intrude supposedly on someone else's benefit.

Anderkent 13y ago
The representatives of these people are hardly in a situation where they can make an informed decision. Even if they were, they have no right of condemning their children to such life.
- userulluipeste 13y ago
  We are getting into politics here. We all have representatives and policy makers that are deciding all the time for us and we also have to support the consequences of their decisions, no mater how informed they were.
- annnnd 13y ago
  That doesn't really matter. If a girl refuses to go out with you, she might not be in a position where she can make an informed decision. And she is possibly depriving her future children of a magnificent father, condemning them to life without you. But you should still respect her "NO". On a more serious note, given some historic evidence how our contact with other tribes ended (pick any tribe, anytime, anywhere) I am both surprised and happy that they exist. I hope they stay the same for as long as possible and may we never learn anything about them.
  - Anderkent 13y ago
    But if a man is jumping of a cliff because he thinks he can fly, you should not respect his 'NO' when trying to catch him. Your serious argument is one of the little valid points raised so far. And I agree, we might not be in a position to help them now. But the statements that even if we could bring them to our society in a humane manner we still shouldn't, because they're clearly fine as they are... That just disgusts me.
    - ctdonath 13y ago
      They're not jumping off a cliff. They've been doing fine (insofar as they're surviving with a small population) for some 60 thousand years. First contact alone will probably kill them with diseases (a well-documented phenomenon). More akin to a guy standing on a ledge of a cliff, albeit precarious but doing fine; if you try to help him, he'll probably fall and die fast. He knows this, and he's telling you to stay the he11 away. That said, I am sympathetic with your basic view. Les Stroud's Beyond Survival was fascinating, but the recurring theme of "and this ancient people is about to die out or lose their culture" struck me as "well, if doing stupid things[1] isn't survivable then maybe those ways should change, and the consequences of sticking to them are natural." The Sentinese however seem to be holding it together pretty well; not advancing, but living on what is otherwise a stereotypical tropical paradise island (food growing on trees, good climate, water), methinks they've achieved some form of comfortable equilibrium and are doing pretty well (I'm sure some here on HN are thinking "I'd like to join them"). Someone mentioned above "your 100 kids will leave the island, move to India, and become call center employees". That vs. where & how they're living now, I'm not so sure "bring[ing] them to our society in a humane manner" really is. Someday it will happen, someday modern life will crash into their ancient and stable culture, someday they will have to deal with new diseases and cell phones and high-speed transport, and "someday" probably isn't very long from now. "But the kids need to do X and Y and Z!" my wife declares. "They're content and playing nicely with their toys and crayons," I'll reply. "Let them enjoy it a little longer." [1] - the clincher was a tribe that fishes by dangling bare hooks in the ocean for hours while sitting on poles. I'm amazed that culture lasted so long. Yeah, they need some help.

Shivetya 13y ago

Considering the state of our affairs, I think we are doing them best by not interfering in their way of life.

prof_hobart 13y ago

> I guess all I'm saying is that not establishing contact is also a choice that we're making on their behalf. It's also a choice that they are making for themselves. It may or may not be a fully informed choice, but they are making their opinions pretty clear. They certainly aren't coming across as a group of people looking desperately to some outside group to save them from anything.

geuis 13y ago

Answer 1: Yes, stay the fuck away. If Race XYZ has ability to monitor us without us knowing, thus not interfering with us, sure go ahead. Its not like there's much we could to stop them. But the moment they make their existence known, we're fucked. At that moment, we aren't the world-conquering successful species we love and proclaim to be. We're the little tribe living on the little island that's quietly being protected by the corrupt government of a minor power in the universal state of nations and empires that we just are now learning about. There's a lot of euphemisms in my last few sentences. Figure them out. Leave these people alone. This is kind of in response to your second point. Think about the scale of what we're talking about. We have a massively global, interconnected society of both economy and knowledge comprising billions of people. Even the poorest person in the most desolate parts of the world can, with some inconvenience, get on to the Internet. The people on this island, 400-1000 souls that they be, don't even have the understanding of modern society that the poorest person in the modern world has. Where do you start with that? So suppose your friendly aliens show up and say "Hi!". What then? We're the people that struggle to maintain ONE space station. We have no extra-terrestrial colonies or establishments. Aliens decide to claim Mars? What are we going to do? The Moon? Its theirs. Pretty much anything outside of our little island Earth is open for claim, and not by us necessarily. The fucked up part is that if you traveled tens or hundreds of light years to get here, Earth itself is probably not the main goal. Its just the natural resources of the system. And what happens in a few hundred years when we decide to get off our asses and go into space? Nothing's left, because fucking Zork claimed it all. So when you think about all of this together, what options do you present to these people even if they were interested? Medicine, food? Sure. Maybe we can get them vaccinated before the common cold or bird flu wipes them out. Education? Here's some books representing external human history from the perspective of the people supplying the money. Oh, check out our religion too! By the way, did you know that your island is one of several others claimed by India? Its a big island (not really) with over 1 billion people. Too many to count? Don't worry, once your 100 kids have moved to Bangalore to become tech support reps and within 20 years your entire culture has died they'll be able to explain. I know this is a bit rambly, but hopefully you can see where I'm going. There is no benefit to the people in question to be contacted by us. It only changes and hurts them.

precisioncoder 13y ago

rapind 13y ago

Considering they have no marketable skills or education, how could their situation get any better? There are tons of poor people in the world who die from easily preventable diseases that you could help instead if that's your true motivation. They are a self-sufficient people that don't seem to be screwing up the world nearly as much as we are... why would we even assume we're superior? Maybe we're just jealous?

gotrythis 13y ago
Exactly!!!! They are superior in that they are sustainable, and it's so horrible that people want to convert them into us. Let's build them a Walmart while we're at it.
s_q_b 13y ago
Personally I like refrigeration, modern medicine, transportation, and high technology. Maybe those aren't your thing, but I know if I was born into a society like that, I would spend my life trying to see what was beyond the water. Or die. Because, you know, a lot of them die.
- freyr 13y ago
  We all die.
  - chronic25 13y ago
    They die sooner.
  - johnchristopher 13y ago
    I am pretty sure parent wanted to point out that we live much longer.
- rapind 13y ago
  Life's good when you're at the top of the totem poll. However, if the greener grass turns out to be a Mumbai slum or an e-waste site in China, or one of many other terrible but more realistic fates, maybe you'd pass on that opportunity... because, you know, a lot of people die there too.

3327 13y ago

Ehm, Isn't their violent reaction a clear representation of their choice? Individuals might want to get out and wonder as you say, but some makes a choice for them - their leaders. For one reason or another good or bad. Just like people make choices for you and you have bare minimum say. They way your government, state government, mayor they all make choices that impact your life one way or another, some highly, some to a low degree. >I guess all I'm saying is that not establishing contact is also a choice that we're making on their behalf. Is deciding that they can't parttake in modern society any more OK than deciding they must? Can we not contact them in a way where they get to choose? so NO!

sampo 13y ago

One one hand: Most of the Australian aborigine people had walked out of the desert by the 1960's, but in 1984 a family of 9 that had lived in the desert, finally also walked out to reunite with their relatives [1]. The relatives had already lived ca. 20 years in an Australian village nearby. When they finally saw the comfortable lifestyle their relatives had enjoyed already for 20 years, they were quite angry [2] that they had been left living in the desert, and not contacted earlier: "They told us there was plenty of food and water came out of pipes," Yardi said. "The older ones were angry that their long-lost relatives – who they had not seen for nearly 20 years – had left them out in the desert eating lizards while they lived in what they saw as the lap of luxury," "I like this life," Yardi said. "I much prefer it to the old ways." Warlinipirri said: "I wouldn't go back." [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pintupi_Nine http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pintupi_Nine [2] http://www.heraldsun.com.au/archive/news/lost-tribe-happy-in-modern-world/story-e6frf7l6-1111112932308 http://www.heraldsun.com.au/archive/news/lost-tribe-happy-in...

sampo 13y ago
On the other hand: The Sentinelese people (of the article) are not the only indigenous people around there, they are just on the most distant island. On nearby larger islands there live e.g. the Jarawa [1] and Onge [2] people and some others [3]. The Jawara inhabit jungle areas of a larger island, that has also for already very long time been settled by Indian farmers. The Jarawa used to stay in the jungle, and there were occasional violent encounter and conflicts. But in 1997 the Jarawa started to make peaceful visits to nearby villages, wanting food and gifts. The farmers see the Jarawa as a nuisance. They don't want to escalate violence, but they also don't want the Jarawa to learn that they could walk in people's homes and steal whatever they want. Apparently [4,5] the Jarawa and Onge languages are not very well studied, either. So, whatever anthropological, cultural and humanitarian interest anyone might have toward the un-contacted people on the North Sentinel island, they could first direct their interest and charity toward these other nearby tribes who have already had some contact with civilization for last decades or centuries, but are apparently not faring very well at the moment. [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jarawa_people_%28Andaman_Islands%29 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jarawa_people_%28Andaman_Island... [2] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Onge_people http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Onge_people [3] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andaman_Islands#Indigenous_Andamanese http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andaman_Islands#Indigenous_Anda... [4] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jarawa_language_%28Andaman_Islands%29 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jarawa_language_%28Andaman_Isla... [5] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Onge_language http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Onge_language

bobbydavid 13y ago

one thing about the western world, and America especially: we have no cultural memory of what it feels like to have another culture impose their value system upon you. it's therefore easy to see other cultural views as falling into these categories: odd/silly, needlessly restrictive (possibly also immoral), or downright immoral [1]. that's a mental trap, though, much like believing yourself to live at the center of the universe. once you remove the "superior culture" argument, it becomes quite hard to formulating a reason to touch this island. for instance: we have medicine! but we only value it because we fear death, etc. [1] examples come to mind: some cultures believe using birth control is like murder (silly). some cultures believe a woman should not exposition her shoulders in public (no rights). some cultures believe infanticide is acceptable, others find it natural for men to have romantic relationships with boys (immoral). these are all examples from a western perspective, of course.

rtpg 13y ago
>for instance: we have medicine! but we only value it because we fear death, etc. I could understand that argument when considering prolonging of life when you're already really old and pretty much falling apart, but for completely preventable deaths? I remember reading somewhere that a cult of death is considered a pretty universal value.

bobbydavid 13y ago

deleted 13y ago

[deleted]

anigbrowl 13y ago

That they violently defend themselves is of course a highly complicating factor. I feel that this is a choice of theirs that should be respected rather than considered as an inconvenient obstacle. True, it's an ignorant choice, but nothing is preventing them taking a more curious stance.

gambler 13y ago

I guess all I'm saying is that not establishing contact is also a choice that we're making on their behalf. Assimilating a culture is an irreversible action. Once it's assimilated, there is no going back. Once we assimilate everyone on the planet, there will be no enclaves. Nothing to learn or wonder about. Is it not scary? To be a complete monoculture? If everyone on Earth could join advanced aliens any time, could Earth be considered an independent society?