4 ms·

This disgusts me. Sooner or later, my public announcement of this disgust is going to place me on a list of people that are seen as dissenters, since all of ou

by junto 13y ago

This disgusts me. Sooner or later, my public announcement of this disgust is going to place me on a list of people that are seen as dissenters, since all of our electronic communication is now being logged for posterity. That list will at some point be renamed "terrorists". At some point in the future (as a non-American), the United States would find it legally acceptable that I can be targeted by a drone and blown up into little pieces. Should wife, my children (one a toddler and the other a baby) happen to be present, then they will be considered "collateral damage". I love the idea of the American dream and the spirit of free speech and the glorious constitution that you have / had in America, but I'm sorry, you've just lost me. I'm like a lover you just beat up for the first time. I've lost that sparkle of first love. I'm crying inside. I'm scared to show you that emotion, because I'm afraid you'll use it against me. You're a bully and there is no teacher to get you back in line. You scare me. I know this will get downvoted to hell, but I just had to splurge my mind.

sdoering 13y ago
I just had to upvote, as you so totally found the words to express my thoughts and feelings regarding the former great idea, that was called the US of A.
derefr 13y ago
> Sooner or later, my public announcement of this disgust is going to place me on a list of people that are seen as dissenters Are you sure? If half of the US citizenship also expresses public disgust at the same thing, there's not much use in making a list; that list may as well be the phone book.
- randallsquared 13y ago
  Do you think that half the US citizenship will ever express an opinion on any specific topic at all? Or even one tenth?
  - derefr 13y ago
    Alright, half is hyperbolic--but you can get a fairly-large portion of the population aping all sorts of crazy messages by putting them in the mouth of a candidate during an election. I'm guessing there'll be a whole lot of "disgust" coming from the Republicans in 2016.
- Spearchucker 13y ago
  "If half of the US citizenship..." Only, that's not going to happen, is it?
- junto 13y ago
  It is of course an exaggeration, but my point was more that the technology is now there to make that list. As a foreigner, this list could prevent me entering the United States. Comments posted on Twitter and Facebook have been used as reasons to reject people from entering the US in recent times. Remember that US citizens get different rules to everyone else. UN charters such as those on prisoner's of war, human rights and torture have been ripped up by the last two US administrations. It is pertinent to note that the US does it's brutality outside the US and generally away from the eyes of its own citizens. Other brutal regimes tend to fall quickly because they do that to their own. As I see it from the outside, your country has been stolen from you without your knowledge. It is organisations like Wikileaks and people like Edward Snowden that have started to tell us all the truth. This is why they are so important, and so very very dangerous to the powers behind the throne. Ok, tin foil hat time: Imagine for a minute that Obama and Bush both entered into power without nefarious aims. Imagine that you sit in the Oval Office on day one of your presidency when some guy in a black suit gets shown in. He says "Good morning Mr President" and presents you with a little black folder. You open the folder and flick through the pages and pages of documents, reading it slowly. You look up and say to the man, "Who are you? What do you want?". The man gives you a cell phone and says, "You keep this phone with you at all times. You do not question the person at the other end. You do not speak about this to anyone else. You'll have some wins as president if you play ball, but otherwise we own you". "I, sitting at my desk, certainly had the authorities to wiretap anyone, from you or your accountant, to a federal judge or even the President, if I had a personal e-mail," That kind of power makes sure that politicians do their bidding. Whoever "they" are. Ok, tin-foil hat back in the drawer...
  - JonSkeptic 13y ago
    I do love a good conspiracy theory.
    - junto 13y ago
      Me too! One of favorites was the 90's BBC television series "House of Cards" and its sequel "To Play the King". http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/House_of_Cards_(UK_TV_series) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/House_of_Cards_(UK_TV_series)
- outworlder 13y ago
  At some point, 1 in 6.5 citizens of the GDR were STASI informants (source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stasi http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stasi) And yet, that was not enough to topple the regime, that only happened later. You'll probably find that the phonebook can become very fat indeed.
- Shivetya 13y ago
  There is always the IRS, but of course no one in the government, let alone the IRS, would ever use their position to stifle freedom of expression. Oh wait, Congress is having hearings today on that. They are already doing what your claiming they cannot possibly do. Its time to acknowledge that there is very little they cannot do, or worse are doing that we still haven't found out
  - bobwaycott 13y ago
    The evidence and reports that have thus far been released and discussed regarding the IRS's actions leave very little room to suggest they used their position to stifle freedom of expression.
- ctdonath 13y ago
  Oppressive governments are notorious for killing off large percentages of their populations to eliminate dissenters and dissuade survivors from even contemplating dissent.
- coldcode 13y ago
  Given what the NSA is doing, it is the phone book.
minimize_me 13y ago
"I'm like a lover you just beat up for the first time" Surely that just demonstrates poor knowledge of history? I mean, between the unethical experimentation on its own citizens of the 20th century and before, Japanese internment camps, the Gulf of Tonkin, the overthrowing of democratic governments in Iran, Iran-Contra, drone attacks for the past 7+ years, Guantanamo, the illegal invasion of Iraq, retroactive immunity for executors of some of the aforementioned...(and that's just off the top of my rather poor memory), how could your disdain have only recently arisen? I find that a better analogy would be an uncle who gave you nice Christmas presents, so you ignored the persistent rumours that he molested your cousins. And now you're starting to receive the same treatment.
- madaxe 13y ago
  That analogy is just fantastic - although the uncle is also the local judge, so can't be prosecuted, but he keeps sending other people who do the same as him to prison.

by junto 13y ago

sdoering 13y ago

I just had to upvote, as you so totally found the words to express my thoughts and feelings regarding the former great idea, that was called the US of A.

derefr 13y ago

> Sooner or later, my public announcement of this disgust is going to place me on a list of people that are seen as dissenters Are you sure? If half of the US citizenship also expresses public disgust at the same thing, there's not much use in making a list; that list may as well be the phone book.

randallsquared 13y ago
Do you think that half the US citizenship will ever express an opinion on any specific topic at all? Or even one tenth?
- derefr 13y ago
  Alright, half is hyperbolic--but you can get a fairly-large portion of the population aping all sorts of crazy messages by putting them in the mouth of a candidate during an election. I'm guessing there'll be a whole lot of "disgust" coming from the Republicans in 2016.
Spearchucker 13y ago
"If half of the US citizenship..." Only, that's not going to happen, is it?
junto 13y ago
It is of course an exaggeration, but my point was more that the technology is now there to make that list. As a foreigner, this list could prevent me entering the United States. Comments posted on Twitter and Facebook have been used as reasons to reject people from entering the US in recent times. Remember that US citizens get different rules to everyone else. UN charters such as those on prisoner's of war, human rights and torture have been ripped up by the last two US administrations. It is pertinent to note that the US does it's brutality outside the US and generally away from the eyes of its own citizens. Other brutal regimes tend to fall quickly because they do that to their own. As I see it from the outside, your country has been stolen from you without your knowledge. It is organisations like Wikileaks and people like Edward Snowden that have started to tell us all the truth. This is why they are so important, and so very very dangerous to the powers behind the throne. Ok, tin foil hat time: Imagine for a minute that Obama and Bush both entered into power without nefarious aims. Imagine that you sit in the Oval Office on day one of your presidency when some guy in a black suit gets shown in. He says "Good morning Mr President" and presents you with a little black folder. You open the folder and flick through the pages and pages of documents, reading it slowly. You look up and say to the man, "Who are you? What do you want?". The man gives you a cell phone and says, "You keep this phone with you at all times. You do not question the person at the other end. You do not speak about this to anyone else. You'll have some wins as president if you play ball, but otherwise we own you". "I, sitting at my desk, certainly had the authorities to wiretap anyone, from you or your accountant, to a federal judge or even the President, if I had a personal e-mail," That kind of power makes sure that politicians do their bidding. Whoever "they" are. Ok, tin-foil hat back in the drawer...
- JonSkeptic 13y ago
  I do love a good conspiracy theory.
  - junto 13y ago
    Me too! One of favorites was the 90's BBC television series "House of Cards" and its sequel "To Play the King". http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/House_of_Cards_(UK_TV_series) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/House_of_Cards_(UK_TV_series)
outworlder 13y ago
At some point, 1 in 6.5 citizens of the GDR were STASI informants (source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stasi http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stasi) And yet, that was not enough to topple the regime, that only happened later. You'll probably find that the phonebook can become very fat indeed.
Shivetya 13y ago
There is always the IRS, but of course no one in the government, let alone the IRS, would ever use their position to stifle freedom of expression. Oh wait, Congress is having hearings today on that. They are already doing what your claiming they cannot possibly do. Its time to acknowledge that there is very little they cannot do, or worse are doing that we still haven't found out
- bobwaycott 13y ago
  The evidence and reports that have thus far been released and discussed regarding the IRS's actions leave very little room to suggest they used their position to stifle freedom of expression.
ctdonath 13y ago
Oppressive governments are notorious for killing off large percentages of their populations to eliminate dissenters and dissuade survivors from even contemplating dissent.
coldcode 13y ago
Given what the NSA is doing, it is the phone book.

minimize_me 13y ago

"I'm like a lover you just beat up for the first time" Surely that just demonstrates poor knowledge of history? I mean, between the unethical experimentation on its own citizens of the 20th century and before, Japanese internment camps, the Gulf of Tonkin, the overthrowing of democratic governments in Iran, Iran-Contra, drone attacks for the past 7+ years, Guantanamo, the illegal invasion of Iraq, retroactive immunity for executors of some of the aforementioned...(and that's just off the top of my rather poor memory), how could your disdain have only recently arisen? I find that a better analogy would be an uncle who gave you nice Christmas presents, so you ignored the persistent rumours that he molested your cousins. And now you're starting to receive the same treatment.

madaxe 13y ago
That analogy is just fantastic - although the uncle is also the local judge, so can't be prosecuted, but he keeps sending other people who do the same as him to prison.