5 ms·

What's crazy about it? I resent that headline. Doing big things should be applauded. Good on them. You want crazy? America binding itself hand and foot with it

by enko 13y ago

What's crazy about it? I resent that headline. Doing big things should be applauded. Good on them. You want crazy? America binding itself hand and foot with its bullshit Chicago School economic idealogy, that's crazy. It is absolute frigging nonsense and will be the ruin of the country. Now watch everyone else eat its breakfast, lunch and dinner. Note: This tunnel would "cost" china less than one month of the USA's "quantitative easing". For whatever "cost" means to a government that can print its own money. The hilarious thing is, the USA can't pump that money into infrastructure projects because of their stupid, stupid political aversion to a misunderstood fear of SOCIALISM! So they have to funnel everything through the banks. China doesn't give a shit, pumps money straight into infrastructure. At the end of the day, China has the infrastructure, the USA has what? Some banker's bonuses and another thousand foreclosed houses. So what were you saying about "crazy"?

Zikes 13y ago
Well, we do have the world's longest bridge over water: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lake_Pontchartrain_Causeway http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lake_Pontchartrain_Causeway Not that world-record holding structures should be an indicator of economic stability, as China is notoriously bad about using them to artificially inflate their GDP at the cost of their citizenry.
- enko 13y ago
  It's not about who's the record-holder. It's about the whole concept of a central government seeing that investment in infrastructure benefits the country - and the economy - as a whole. The USA that built this bridge - in the 1950s and 60s - was completely different from today. The USA of today could never build this bridge, or any other large project.
  - VladRussian2 13y ago
    yep, it was the USA of Moon landing.
- baby 13y ago
  I don't think it is, see : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_longest_bridges_in_the_world http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_longest_bridges_in_the_... Also this list is way more interesting imo : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_longest_suspension_bridge_spans http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_longest_suspension_brid...
protomyth 13y ago
First, "crazy" isn't automatically a negative term. It can even be seen as positive. Apple used the word in a ad campaign[1] early in Steve Job's[2] return. As to the infrastructure, it really has nothing to do with some fear of socialism. It is very much the problem of cost s, regulatory hurdles, and (increasingly) lack of skilled workers to carry out the construction. Court costs are the biggest killer. Every group is going to bring a lawsuit in any big infrastructure project. China doesn't have to worry about that[3]. For all the talk, if high speed rail was $1 million per mile and we had no lawsuits, we would have the things all over the place. 1) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tjgtLSHhTPg http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tjgtLSHhTPg 2) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=syhEFKuX5yI http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=syhEFKuX5yI 3) sometimes this hurts more than helps when problems arise in the project
- markdown 13y ago
  > It is very much the problem of ...and (increasingly) lack of skilled workers to carry out the construction. I don't think a major construction project anywhere else in the world exclusively uses homegrown labour and technology. Are you implying that the US can't/won't hire german/dutch/japanese/chinese engineers for infrastructure projects? When the whole world is your labour market, lack of skilled labour can't be an excuse.
  - protomyth 13y ago
    Engineers do not build infrastructure projects. They design them and supervise. I am talking about the people who can actually do welding, plumbing, construction, etc. Its not exactly easy to get foreign workers into the US to do vocational work. Projects around the oil fields in ND are delayed or cancelled because of a lack of workers. Heck, the oil companies are currently recruiting in Canada.
- vacri 13y ago
  In that Apple ad, 'crazy' is used as a negative. "While some may see crazy ones, we see -foo-". They're saying that what others call crazy, we see as not crazy. They also only used example of people who proved their success decades before the ad aired, basically capitalising on hindsight and not making even the slightest of bets. None of those people were thought of as crazy when the ad aired - and of course, they weren't going to predict a few contemporary crazies because betting on crazy is generally a losing bet when you don't benefit from selection bias.
quahada 13y ago
This really comes down to the need/demand for the infrastructure. Projects like this do occasionally happen in the US. NYC is getting a 60 mile long, $6B water tunnel. Unfortunately, that tunnel has been under construction for decades, and is still years from completion. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_City_Water_Tunnel_No._3#Tunnels http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_City_Water_Tunnel_No._...
jsnk 13y ago
You sound like a college freshman who heard some words that professors and talking heads on TV say and regurgitate them into your speech without comprehension.
- enko 13y ago
  Thanks. You sound like you have some vague disagreement about what I said, but can't express it in any meaningful way, so instead you came up with that.
swamp40 13y ago
Well maybe the US should peg its dollar to the Yuan and see what kind of "crazy" things we could do with the surplus? Maybe we could buy Taiwan?
contingencies 13y ago
Doing big things should be applauded Err...

by enko 13y ago

Zikes 13y ago

Well, we do have the world's longest bridge over water: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lake_Pontchartrain_Causeway http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lake_Pontchartrain_Causeway Not that world-record holding structures should be an indicator of economic stability, as China is notoriously bad about using them to artificially inflate their GDP at the cost of their citizenry.

enko 13y ago
It's not about who's the record-holder. It's about the whole concept of a central government seeing that investment in infrastructure benefits the country - and the economy - as a whole. The USA that built this bridge - in the 1950s and 60s - was completely different from today. The USA of today could never build this bridge, or any other large project.
- VladRussian2 13y ago
  yep, it was the USA of Moon landing.
baby 13y ago
I don't think it is, see : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_longest_bridges_in_the_world http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_longest_bridges_in_the_... Also this list is way more interesting imo : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_longest_suspension_bridge_spans http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_longest_suspension_brid...

protomyth 13y ago

First, "crazy" isn't automatically a negative term. It can even be seen as positive. Apple used the word in a ad campaign[1] early in Steve Job's[2] return. As to the infrastructure, it really has nothing to do with some fear of socialism. It is very much the problem of cost s, regulatory hurdles, and (increasingly) lack of skilled workers to carry out the construction. Court costs are the biggest killer. Every group is going to bring a lawsuit in any big infrastructure project. China doesn't have to worry about that[3]. For all the talk, if high speed rail was $1 million per mile and we had no lawsuits, we would have the things all over the place. 1) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tjgtLSHhTPg http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tjgtLSHhTPg 2) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=syhEFKuX5yI http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=syhEFKuX5yI 3) sometimes this hurts more than helps when problems arise in the project

markdown 13y ago
> It is very much the problem of ...and (increasingly) lack of skilled workers to carry out the construction. I don't think a major construction project anywhere else in the world exclusively uses homegrown labour and technology. Are you implying that the US can't/won't hire german/dutch/japanese/chinese engineers for infrastructure projects? When the whole world is your labour market, lack of skilled labour can't be an excuse.
- protomyth 13y ago
  Engineers do not build infrastructure projects. They design them and supervise. I am talking about the people who can actually do welding, plumbing, construction, etc. Its not exactly easy to get foreign workers into the US to do vocational work. Projects around the oil fields in ND are delayed or cancelled because of a lack of workers. Heck, the oil companies are currently recruiting in Canada.
vacri 13y ago
In that Apple ad, 'crazy' is used as a negative. "While some may see crazy ones, we see -foo-". They're saying that what others call crazy, we see as not crazy. They also only used example of people who proved their success decades before the ad aired, basically capitalising on hindsight and not making even the slightest of bets. None of those people were thought of as crazy when the ad aired - and of course, they weren't going to predict a few contemporary crazies because betting on crazy is generally a losing bet when you don't benefit from selection bias.

quahada 13y ago

This really comes down to the need/demand for the infrastructure. Projects like this do occasionally happen in the US. NYC is getting a 60 mile long, $6B water tunnel. Unfortunately, that tunnel has been under construction for decades, and is still years from completion. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_City_Water_Tunnel_No._3#Tunnels http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_City_Water_Tunnel_No._...

jsnk 13y ago

You sound like a college freshman who heard some words that professors and talking heads on TV say and regurgitate them into your speech without comprehension.

enko 13y ago
Thanks. You sound like you have some vague disagreement about what I said, but can't express it in any meaningful way, so instead you came up with that.

swamp40 13y ago

Well maybe the US should peg its dollar to the Yuan and see what kind of "crazy" things we could do with the surplus? Maybe we could buy Taiwan?

contingencies 13y ago

Doing big things should be applauded Err...