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"When you’re paying for your social network, it makes you a customer instead of a product". Wrong, you're still a product. The "consumer vs. product" dilemma i
by gordaco 13y ago
"When you’re paying for your social network, it makes you a customer instead of a product".
Wrong, you're still a product. The "consumer vs. product" dilemma is a false one.
- ekianjo 13y agoPlease explain. Are you saying that App.net is using your data anyway to sell ads or something else?
- robryan 13y agoWell, not sure what the OP is suggesting but your content is definitely a product that is attract other users to also pay.
- drivebyacct2 13y agoNetwork effects are something people already pay for: XBL, PSN, WoW, other games like WoW that I don't know.
- ekianjo 13y agoMaybe, if he turns it in this way. I was however referring to what Apps.net says on their about page: https://app.net/about/ https://app.net/about/ "We are selling our product, NOT our users. We will never sell your personal data, content, feed, interests, clicks, or anything else to advertisers. We promise."
- Kiro 13y agoYes.
- sbuk 13y agoCan you illustrate this in direct relation to App.net?
- Heliosmaster 13y agoAs already mentioned above: their are probably not selling directly your information (in the sense of these days revelations), but they are selling their product because of your content. Simple network effect: the more people there are, the more valuable their application is, the more traction it gains toward new users, the more new users there are. Making money through you. (Like all user-generated content websites)
- sbuk 13y agoThat parently isn't the same as selling advertisers information. Nor is it the same as tracking and selling that to advertisers. It's entirely disingenuous to suggest so.
- Volpe 13y agoNo, it's disingenuous to suggest YOUR content is unrelated to the value of THEIR product. A reasonable analogy would be conferences, are you paying for the venue, or the access to other people/speakers? does that mean the people/speakers are the product?
- sbuk 13y agoMy contribution being of value to the site is one thing. Tracking that contribution and using it to target advertising is a completely different thing. Suggesting otherwise, as you and others appear to be doing, is deliberately disingenuous.
- 13y ago
- benastan 13y agoI think you mean "dichotomy", not "dilemma."
- asafh 13y agoHe means that in the sense of the either-or fallacy[1] [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_dilemma http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_dilemma
- belorn 13y agoIf there is an transaction between the user and the company, i.e. data in exchange for service, I do find it a bit strange that the tax office has not started to extract sales tax on it. Might be a bit evil/selfish, but I somewhat hope that services that user need to pay for with personal data gets taxed, just so that truly "free" services can get an competitive edge on the market.
- takluyver 13y agoWell, when you pay with money, the government takes a percentage of that money. And when you pay with data, the government takes a percentage of that.
- finnw 13y agoEventually (e.g. via targeted advertising) they convert that data to cash. If they weren't going to make cash from it, they would not be collecting it in the first place. And when they do convert it to cash, that cash will be taxed.
- muyuu 13y agoIf you're paying for it, then there is an incentive for the company to give you the service other than profiteering on your data. Obviously it's still not a guarantee.
- vog 13y agoWhere should this incentive come from? There are lots of companies that simply sell you the serive and at the same time profiteering on your data. Unless, of course, privacy is part of that service, but even then the company isn't trustworth unless it actively encourages use of end-to-end encryption wherever feasible.
- throwaway1979 13y agoCase in point: duckduckgo
- muyuu 13y agoI think you missed the part where I said that it's not a guarantee. Obviously, it's not a guarantee. They can still profit both ways. But if they have another means of profit, then there is the possibility that they're not dead set on profiteering on your data. This is still not good enough for me though. Self-hosted or nothing as far as I'm concerned (Social Networks).
- SamWhited 13y agomuyuu: Absolutely right (although, depending on the social network and how federation is handled they could possibly sell your data even if it's self hosted). If you know of any other good self-hosted social networks I'd love to hear about them. Feel free to email me; I may or may not see it in the deluge of comments here (see the about page on my blog).