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It's not about the camera, it's about presenting Nokia as a producer of a premium phone, so that other versions of Nokia look better in comparison. No one cares

It's not about the camera, it's about presenting Nokia as a producer of a premium phone, so that other versions of Nokia look better in comparison. No one cares about Windows Phone, but when Nokia makes headlines for 41-megapixels, the general populace that doesn't really get that they don't need 41-megapixels will nevertheless notice, and think 'wow, that is a lot, does my iPhone have that?'. 99.9% of people who will buy this phone will never have a need for 41 megapixels. But they'll buy it just the same.

jcarney 13y ago
>99.9% of people who will buy this phone will never have a need for 41 megapixels. But they'll buy it just the same. The tech does make normal pictures look better because of the oversampling. Not to mention optical image stabilization for reducing blur and shake in both image and video. http://i.imgur.com/fUe8rLC.png http://i.imgur.com/fUe8rLC.png
- deleted 13y ago
  [deleted]
slantyyz 13y ago
>> 99.9% of people who will buy this phone will never have a need for 41 megapixels. Nokia's really screwing up the messaging on this, as people are fixating on the megapixel count -- they are missing the forest for the trees. The best images you will get out of this phone will actually be the oversampled images, which have significantly fewer megapixels.
- meerita 13y ago
  41 megapixels can't be nice on a crappy sensor and lenses system. 41 megapixels would be interesting on a real camera unless someone wants to print oversampled stuff.
  - slantyyz 13y ago
    You don't need to print to see the improvements the oversampled images provide. You should see much cleaner images, especially in low light. These are noticeable even at Facebook level resolutions. Anyone who has used a real camera would know that.
    - drdaeman 13y ago
      There's completely no point in such sensor if lens are not providing equally high resolution image too. Unless you're into shooting Airy disks (though, I don't think the phone will provide raw sensor data). That is, the whole 41MP thing is, mostly, PR bullshit.
      - slantyyz 13y ago
        Well, this camera's spiritual predecessor, the 808 seemed to shoot high megapixel images just fine. The Verge's 100% crops of the 34MP images look fine to me. http://www.theverge.com/2012/6/25/3113460/nokia-808-pureview-review http://www.theverge.com/2012/6/25/3113460/nokia-808-pureview... edit: DPReview gave the 808's camera and IQ a glowing review also. http://www.dpreview.com/articles/8083837371/review-nokia-808-pureview http://www.dpreview.com/articles/8083837371/review-nokia-808...
- mmanfrin 13y ago
  Nokia's really screwing up the messaging on this, as people are fixating on the megapixel count HTC has been trying to push the message you suggest with the camera on the HTC One, and while the One is a great device and (I think) doing well for HTC, no one is really talking about their camera -- even though it is a superior camera to most other phones. Megapixels are like Clock Speed was a decade ago: there are more important stats to look at, but consumers just see the one number. I'm not making any judgement, I'm just saying the point of 41 megapixels isn't to give consumers a huge picture, it's to give them a reason to buy the phone.
  - slantyyz 13y ago
    What HTC did do a good job of was branding their pixels as "Ultrapixels". I see that branding used on all the major tech blogs when mentioning the HTC One's camera. Nokia's making the mistake of pushing a camera with specs that isn't easily understood by many people, and from the looks of it, that seems to include people who consider themselves photographers. I tend to think that the 41 megapixel count will turn off many prospective buyers ("Why the hell do I need so many megapixels?").
    - mmanfrin 13y ago
      I sincerely doubt that people looking at the highest-end cost of phones will be thinking 'Why do I need [feature x]?'.
      - slantyyz 13y ago
        Yeah, but they'll look at that less-than-beautiful hump on the back and ask if that hump is worth the extra megapixels.
- vanderZwan 13y ago
  I do believe Nokia has been very clear that the high megapixels is meant to be used as supersampling to reduce noise in normal sized pictures. They are after all targeting the enthusiast photographer who likes to (believe he) understands how camera's work. Also, from an engineering point of view it's pretty neat: if the idea is to downsize the final picture to 5 mp, while using cropping on the pre-downsampled image to zoom, that means you can focus on having a high optical resolution in the centre of a fixed focal lens, and worry less about the edges. That has lots of advantages: a fixed focal lens is less complicated than a zoom lens, which has the side effect of making it easier to keep the lense flat,and getting a higher optical resolution in the centre is easier to do from an optics standpoint.
  - jlarocco 13y ago
    No, I'm pretty sure they're going for the "OMG! A lot of mega-pixels, it must be better" crowd. Most enthusiast photographers will realize 41 MP with a tiny, tiny image sensor is going to be pointless.
    - vanderZwan 13y ago
      I highly doubt that, as the 808 has already disproven that statement and has quite the reputation among enthusiast photographers.

jcarney 13y ago

>99.9% of people who will buy this phone will never have a need for 41 megapixels. But they'll buy it just the same. The tech does make normal pictures look better because of the oversampling. Not to mention optical image stabilization for reducing blur and shake in both image and video. http://i.imgur.com/fUe8rLC.png http://i.imgur.com/fUe8rLC.png

deleted 13y ago
[deleted]

slantyyz 13y ago

>> 99.9% of people who will buy this phone will never have a need for 41 megapixels. Nokia's really screwing up the messaging on this, as people are fixating on the megapixel count -- they are missing the forest for the trees. The best images you will get out of this phone will actually be the oversampled images, which have significantly fewer megapixels.

meerita 13y ago
41 megapixels can't be nice on a crappy sensor and lenses system. 41 megapixels would be interesting on a real camera unless someone wants to print oversampled stuff.
- slantyyz 13y ago
  You don't need to print to see the improvements the oversampled images provide. You should see much cleaner images, especially in low light. These are noticeable even at Facebook level resolutions. Anyone who has used a real camera would know that.
  - drdaeman 13y ago
    There's completely no point in such sensor if lens are not providing equally high resolution image too. Unless you're into shooting Airy disks (though, I don't think the phone will provide raw sensor data). That is, the whole 41MP thing is, mostly, PR bullshit.
    - slantyyz 13y ago
      Well, this camera's spiritual predecessor, the 808 seemed to shoot high megapixel images just fine. The Verge's 100% crops of the 34MP images look fine to me. http://www.theverge.com/2012/6/25/3113460/nokia-808-pureview-review http://www.theverge.com/2012/6/25/3113460/nokia-808-pureview... edit: DPReview gave the 808's camera and IQ a glowing review also. http://www.dpreview.com/articles/8083837371/review-nokia-808-pureview http://www.dpreview.com/articles/8083837371/review-nokia-808...
mmanfrin 13y ago
Nokia's really screwing up the messaging on this, as people are fixating on the megapixel count HTC has been trying to push the message you suggest with the camera on the HTC One, and while the One is a great device and (I think) doing well for HTC, no one is really talking about their camera -- even though it is a superior camera to most other phones. Megapixels are like Clock Speed was a decade ago: there are more important stats to look at, but consumers just see the one number. I'm not making any judgement, I'm just saying the point of 41 megapixels isn't to give consumers a huge picture, it's to give them a reason to buy the phone.
- slantyyz 13y ago
  What HTC did do a good job of was branding their pixels as "Ultrapixels". I see that branding used on all the major tech blogs when mentioning the HTC One's camera. Nokia's making the mistake of pushing a camera with specs that isn't easily understood by many people, and from the looks of it, that seems to include people who consider themselves photographers. I tend to think that the 41 megapixel count will turn off many prospective buyers ("Why the hell do I need so many megapixels?").
  - mmanfrin 13y ago
    I sincerely doubt that people looking at the highest-end cost of phones will be thinking 'Why do I need [feature x]?'.
    - slantyyz 13y ago
      Yeah, but they'll look at that less-than-beautiful hump on the back and ask if that hump is worth the extra megapixels.
vanderZwan 13y ago
I do believe Nokia has been very clear that the high megapixels is meant to be used as supersampling to reduce noise in normal sized pictures. They are after all targeting the enthusiast photographer who likes to (believe he) understands how camera's work. Also, from an engineering point of view it's pretty neat: if the idea is to downsize the final picture to 5 mp, while using cropping on the pre-downsampled image to zoom, that means you can focus on having a high optical resolution in the centre of a fixed focal lens, and worry less about the edges. That has lots of advantages: a fixed focal lens is less complicated than a zoom lens, which has the side effect of making it easier to keep the lense flat,and getting a higher optical resolution in the centre is easier to do from an optics standpoint.
- jlarocco 13y ago
  No, I'm pretty sure they're going for the "OMG! A lot of mega-pixels, it must be better" crowd. Most enthusiast photographers will realize 41 MP with a tiny, tiny image sensor is going to be pointless.
  - vanderZwan 13y ago
    I highly doubt that, as the 808 has already disproven that statement and has quite the reputation among enthusiast photographers.