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Entry (since the site is down): "Feds, we need some time apart. Posted 7.10.13 For over two decades DEF CON has been an open nexus of hacker culture, a place
by danielsiders 13y ago
Entry (since the site is down):
"Feds, we need some time apart.
Posted 7.10.13
For over two decades DEF CON has been an open nexus of hacker culture, a place where seasoned pros, hackers, academics, and feds can meet, share ideas and party on neutral territory. Our community operates in the spirit of openness, verified trust, and mutual respect.
When it comes to sharing and socializing with feds, recent revelations have made many in the community uncomfortable about this relationship. Therefore, I think it would be best for everyone involved if the feds call a "time-out" and not attend DEF CON this year.
This will give everybody time to think about how we got here, and what comes next.
The Dark Tangent"
- codyb 13y agoWill this actually affect the feds ability to attend or will they just attend in plain clothes? Or will they be able to attend as feds and just be looked down upon?
- welder 13y agoFeds always attend in plain clothes so this effectively does nothing. I also wonder if a Fed only means investigative or law enforcement type Feds or also includes federally employed IT peoples.
- iamtherockstar 13y agoLast year they had Gen. Keith Alexander, NSA chief. There are usually a handful of talks by "feds". I wonder if their talk schedule has gotten messed up because of this.
- tippytop 13y agoI don't think the intention is to create a moat around the conference. Things have been getting quite cozy between these two [1]; I'm sure recent revelations don't play well with this conference's attendee base. [1] https://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9229756/NSA_chief_asks_hackers_at_Defcon_for_help_securing_cyberspace https://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9229756/NSA_chief_as...
- mcantelon 13y agoA moat "this year" until it's safe for them, PR-wise, to work at legitimizing the feds again.
- majelix 13y agoPerhaps this is why this bothers me: the Feds don't need any help from Defcon. If anything, it's the other way around.
- chris_mahan 13y agoMaybe it should be renamed FedCon.
- btipling 13y agoiamtherockstar you are hellbanned. Your comment appears as dead. I tell you because you made an informative comment. Looks like it happened about a month ago.
- CyberDroiD 13y agothanks for the info noob! quit bothering people.
- nitrogen 13y agoI think I accidentally upvoted this comment when my phone's browser glitched. Meant to downvote.
- richo 13y agoIt basically means that spot the fed will be more eventful this year.
- bobert92 13y agoLiterally, with like paintball guns or some other form of humiliation.
- sillysaurus 13y agoWouldn't that be assaulting a federal agent?
- munin 13y agoor just assault?
- ethanazir 13y agojust alert everyone that they will be engaging in a paintball event; and they consent to the assault.
- sigzero 13y agoI am pretty sure it doesn't work that way. :)
- DennisP 13y agoMaybe if everyone signs a consent form at registration.
- corywright 13y agoThere is no registration at defcon, it's all anonymous. You hand them cash for a badge and a packet of info/stickers/cd and are on your way.
- throwawayDC21 13y agoThere is nothing to mark them as feds, payments are in cash and everyone is in plain clothes. I think this will make very little difference to who attends. It is also worth mentioning that Black Hat (the two days preceding DEF CON) has reportedly seen a drop in registrations due to lack of funding for federal employees to attend (I have no source for this other than industry rumor). There was a suggestion that some would still attend DEF CON and save on the registration cost for Black Hat, but many were planning to stay away anyway. I feel that this is more public relations than anything else, the feds will still be there but DEF CON can present the image of being underground hackers fighting "the man". Some of the smartest people that I have met at these sort of events work for governments around the world, either directly or through private companies. The reason the lines have blurred between the two groups over the past decade is as much to do with money as it is to do with diplomacy or a shared enemy. I think that this statement goes against one of the core values of DEF CON: that everyone is welcome, regardless of background or ability.
- eli 13y agoIt's definitely plausible. Slashed travel and conference budgets have been a major result of the sequester.
- corq 13y agoA good number of the Feds seem to enjoy self-identifying. Many will still attend, but the chemistry will definitely be different.
- marshray 13y agoMy impression was that they enjoy drinking a lot and for many Defcon was the only time of year they got to go "under cover".
- mcantelon 13y ago>everyone is welcome, regardless of background or ability This year, in the spirit of inclusivity, they should bring in the lead architect of the Great Firewall of China.
- beefman 13y agoIt may affect their ability to recruit.
- richo 13y agoHonestly, I doubt it. They had a legit enigma machine last year. It was cool. Their booth was busy because of it. That said, I doubt anyone interested in working for the NSA would be put off by this/the recent leaks, or that anyone who didn't want to work for the NSA was going to change their mind at DEF CON.
- jmharvey 13y agoPeople care about what their peers think of them. Even if a recruit don't have a problem with what the NSA does, the job is significantly less "cool" today than it was not that long ago.
- jack-r-abbit 13y agoNot everyone cares what their peers think of them... particularly if they in turn think their peers are being dicks. And not everyone has the same opinion (or level of outrage) over what the NSA has done.
- marshray 13y agoWhat kind of fool would do all the work to get a security clearance to get a "cool" job at the NSA that they wouldn't be able to tell anyone at all about? It's folklore wisdom that many of those people have to tell their friends and family that they work for the "GSA" doing PC networking or something like that.