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I'm aware of the hierarchy - not sure how it adds to or detracts from my post though? Do you think we inevitably progress up the pyramid as we get older - becau

I'm aware of the hierarchy - not sure how it adds to or detracts from my post though? Do you think we inevitably progress up the pyramid as we get older - because I don't think age or progression up a career ladder is particularly correlated with fulfilment of those needs.

user24 13y ago
I don't understand how you can not see a correlation. The jobs 'higher up' the ladder are generally better paid, with better benefits and are more enjoyable. If you're working 10 hour shifts with two kids and a tiny flat, you don't have much time or energy left to explore self-actualisation. You are living day-to-day, in a perpetual state of tiredness, stress and worry. The only way 'out' is to get a better job. Then you will feel pride, confidence, etc etc - most of the things on the hierarchy. I can't help but think that you have never experienced poverty. That naivety is the only way I can understand why you'd think that "progression up the career ladder" is not correlated with fulfilment of Maslow's needs (or more broadly, the basic ability to live your life the way you want. To live freely.)
- alex-warren 13y ago
  I can't spot the bit in my post where I said I knew what the answer to poverty was - but is the only option for people in poverty really to wait for a promotion? For people who are not in poverty, which I presume includes most of us here idly browsing Hacker News, do we descend down that hierarchy of needs as soon as we step off the conveyor belt? I think there are more paths to fulfilment than you realise.
  - user24 13y ago
    You're grasping for an alternative reality where people don't need to work. But without a concrete suggestion it's just wishful thinking. I think the fact that every large society on the planet ever has been based on this model is important. > is the only option for people in poverty really to wait for a promotion You're overstating my position. Don't wait for an opportunity; create one. But yes, pretty much. There is simply no responsible alternative. You can't run off into the wilderness and fend for yourself. You have to live inside the system we have created. It's really not that oppressive. You should try it. > I think there are more paths to fulfilment than you realise. I think the paths that you see as one are many. edit: > do we descend down that hierarchy of needs as soon as we step off the conveyor belt? No, we don't. Ah I see, so what you're advocating is retirement? I think we agree!
    - alex-warren 13y ago
      Never said people don't need to work, but they should think about the kinds of work they want to do and the kind of life they want they lead, and creatively consider all the opportunities that are available to them. In fact that's pretty much all I'm saying, really.
      - user24 13y ago
        I completely agree with that. You do seem to be pushing hard against something though. It comes off as both arrogant and naive, and leads to misinterpretation. For someone who's just saying "consider your options", it sure seems like you think you're saying a lot more than that. What, exactly, is wrong with new kitchens?

user24 13y ago

I don't understand how you can not see a correlation. The jobs 'higher up' the ladder are generally better paid, with better benefits and are more enjoyable. If you're working 10 hour shifts with two kids and a tiny flat, you don't have much time or energy left to explore self-actualisation. You are living day-to-day, in a perpetual state of tiredness, stress and worry. The only way 'out' is to get a better job. Then you will feel pride, confidence, etc etc - most of the things on the hierarchy. I can't help but think that you have never experienced poverty. That naivety is the only way I can understand why you'd think that "progression up the career ladder" is not correlated with fulfilment of Maslow's needs (or more broadly, the basic ability to live your life the way you want. To live freely.)

alex-warren 13y ago
I can't spot the bit in my post where I said I knew what the answer to poverty was - but is the only option for people in poverty really to wait for a promotion? For people who are not in poverty, which I presume includes most of us here idly browsing Hacker News, do we descend down that hierarchy of needs as soon as we step off the conveyor belt? I think there are more paths to fulfilment than you realise.
- user24 13y ago
  You're grasping for an alternative reality where people don't need to work. But without a concrete suggestion it's just wishful thinking. I think the fact that every large society on the planet ever has been based on this model is important. > is the only option for people in poverty really to wait for a promotion You're overstating my position. Don't wait for an opportunity; create one. But yes, pretty much. There is simply no responsible alternative. You can't run off into the wilderness and fend for yourself. You have to live inside the system we have created. It's really not that oppressive. You should try it. > I think there are more paths to fulfilment than you realise. I think the paths that you see as one are many. edit: > do we descend down that hierarchy of needs as soon as we step off the conveyor belt? No, we don't. Ah I see, so what you're advocating is retirement? I think we agree!
  - alex-warren 13y ago
    Never said people don't need to work, but they should think about the kinds of work they want to do and the kind of life they want they lead, and creatively consider all the opportunities that are available to them. In fact that's pretty much all I'm saying, really.
    - user24 13y ago
      I completely agree with that. You do seem to be pushing hard against something though. It comes off as both arrogant and naive, and leads to misinterpretation. For someone who's just saying "consider your options", it sure seems like you think you're saying a lot more than that. What, exactly, is wrong with new kitchens?