4 ms·

I thought we were clear of this shit.

by nwh 13y ago

cheald 13y ago
Not for a long time, I suspect.
bigiain 13y ago
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Really? My immediate thoughts when Snowden's first revelations came to light were "I wonder just how much our local Australian government has rolled over and played lap-dog to every US intelligence request, no matter _how_ illegal or immoral?" I also have very little faith in the Australian civil rights movement - the US has some powerful, smart, and noisy civil rights activism - here I see very little that appears in any way effectual. Encrypt all the things… -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iEYEARECAAYFAlHabm0ACgkQniy+nkMiY+13aQCgzAN24gQyZpyKZvw38qao2QN2 ryUAn0tLNaZWRMuExrQGHUMzgjB5ourZ =Sd2U -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
- gregsq 13y ago
  Well if your local job centre front desk can access your metadata with the nod of your supervisor upstairs, or if the upcoming referendum on local councils coming under federal auspices succeeds, and would allow as a consequence all levels of government to probe citizens metadata, I'm sure the NSA can. The furore over the NSA data hoovering and the fourth amendment has no parallel in Australia. The general citizenry is completely uninformed, complacent and lazily uninterested in these matters. http://m.heraldsun.com.au/news/law-order/victorians-private-phone-and-email-records-spied-on-by-councils-government-departments-and-other-organisations/story-fni0fee2-1226672826414 http://m.heraldsun.com.au/news/law-order/victorians-private-... http://powerhouse.theglobalmail.org/the-australian-government-snoop-patrol-once-every-two-minutes-247-anyones-data/#!prettyPhoto http://powerhouse.theglobalmail.org/the-australian-governmen...
rhizome 13y ago
You thought wrong, and apparently there is more to come, so put on your seatbelt.
ramblerman 13y ago
I wonder what would cause you to say something so stupid. When you say "this shit" do you mean the negative image the USA is gaining from this? Why on earth would you prefer to remain in ignorant bliss about these happenings?
- nwh 13y ago
  No, I thought that Australia was independent enough that we wouldn't be ferrying our data to the United States. It's a reasonably enough assumption.
  - DanBC 13y ago
    People on HN have been mentioning ECHELON and five eyes. ECHELON is a system from the 90s, and involved Australia, New Zealand, Canada, UK, and the US.
    - mpyne 13y ago
      Five Eyes itself dates back literally to the last World War as well.
- bigiain 13y ago
  I read that not as "stupid", but (perhaps incorrectly) as a fellow Australian finally admitting to themselves that we're fooling ourselves if we think we can point an laugh at USA's treatment of their citizens while hiding behind some expectation that our local government is treating us with any more respect. The sad thing is, our government is no better, out intelligence service is just as amoral and unaccountable, and our civil liberty movement is ineffectual to the point of being invisible. Perhaps "ignorant bliss" was preferable…
  - robryan 13y ago
    Actually it is likely worse than the US, the US government spying would generally stay US government only. Whereas ours in Australia is likely accessible by US agencies.
krapp 13y ago
Non-Americans are going to have to come to terms with the likelihood that their governments cooperate with the US not because of blackmail or coercion or fear, but because they agree with the justification for and procedures surrounding this kind of surveillance, and very much appreciate the US's willingness to throw billions of dollars into the pot to help it happen.

I thought we were clear of this shit.

by nwh 13y ago

I thought we were clear of this shit.

cheald 13y ago

Not for a long time, I suspect.

bigiain 13y ago

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Really? My immediate thoughts when Snowden's first revelations came to light were "I wonder just how much our local Australian government has rolled over and played lap-dog to every US intelligence request, no matter _how_ illegal or immoral?" I also have very little faith in the Australian civil rights movement - the US has some powerful, smart, and noisy civil rights activism - here I see very little that appears in any way effectual. Encrypt all the things… -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iEYEARECAAYFAlHabm0ACgkQniy+nkMiY+13aQCgzAN24gQyZpyKZvw38qao2QN2 ryUAn0tLNaZWRMuExrQGHUMzgjB5ourZ =Sd2U -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

gregsq 13y ago
Well if your local job centre front desk can access your metadata with the nod of your supervisor upstairs, or if the upcoming referendum on local councils coming under federal auspices succeeds, and would allow as a consequence all levels of government to probe citizens metadata, I'm sure the NSA can. The furore over the NSA data hoovering and the fourth amendment has no parallel in Australia. The general citizenry is completely uninformed, complacent and lazily uninterested in these matters. http://m.heraldsun.com.au/news/law-order/victorians-private-phone-and-email-records-spied-on-by-councils-government-departments-and-other-organisations/story-fni0fee2-1226672826414 http://m.heraldsun.com.au/news/law-order/victorians-private-... http://powerhouse.theglobalmail.org/the-australian-government-snoop-patrol-once-every-two-minutes-247-anyones-data/#!prettyPhoto http://powerhouse.theglobalmail.org/the-australian-governmen...

rhizome 13y ago

You thought wrong, and apparently there is more to come, so put on your seatbelt.

ramblerman 13y ago

I wonder what would cause you to say something so stupid. When you say "this shit" do you mean the negative image the USA is gaining from this? Why on earth would you prefer to remain in ignorant bliss about these happenings?

nwh 13y ago
No, I thought that Australia was independent enough that we wouldn't be ferrying our data to the United States. It's a reasonably enough assumption.
- DanBC 13y ago
  People on HN have been mentioning ECHELON and five eyes. ECHELON is a system from the 90s, and involved Australia, New Zealand, Canada, UK, and the US.
  - mpyne 13y ago
    Five Eyes itself dates back literally to the last World War as well.
bigiain 13y ago
I read that not as "stupid", but (perhaps incorrectly) as a fellow Australian finally admitting to themselves that we're fooling ourselves if we think we can point an laugh at USA's treatment of their citizens while hiding behind some expectation that our local government is treating us with any more respect. The sad thing is, our government is no better, out intelligence service is just as amoral and unaccountable, and our civil liberty movement is ineffectual to the point of being invisible. Perhaps "ignorant bliss" was preferable…
- robryan 13y ago
  Actually it is likely worse than the US, the US government spying would generally stay US government only. Whereas ours in Australia is likely accessible by US agencies.

krapp 13y ago

Non-Americans are going to have to come to terms with the likelihood that their governments cooperate with the US not because of blackmail or coercion or fear, but because they agree with the justification for and procedures surrounding this kind of surveillance, and very much appreciate the US's willingness to throw billions of dollars into the pot to help it happen.