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Yes, Manning was in the news. No, you did not hear any statements from him, unless you read the court martial transcript that was made by the reporter who smugg

Yes, Manning was in the news. No, you did not hear any statements from him, unless you read the court martial transcript that was made by the reporter who smuggled in the tape recorder against the court rules of security. Ellsberg wasn't fighting secret courts and secret interpretations of law.

mpyne 13y ago
> Ellsberg wasn't fighting secret courts and secret interpretations of law. Indeed, he was fighting something even worse: a secret conspiracy spanning multiple Presidencies to help force a nation's involvement in war. Nixon took the unprecedented step of suing to stop the publication of the newspapers that were going to print the Pentagon Papers, even though the topics described didn't even occur on his watch. What Ellsberg was dealing in was far more serious, and yet he turned out OK when he turned himself in.
- marshray 13y ago
  I don't dispute that what Ellsberg did was brave and ultimately the system worked. But it literally took having the Supreme Court rule in his favor and the President thrown out of office (a once ever in 237 years event). Snowden's situation is different, the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court is the one who also appoints the judges to the secret FISA court Snowden has exposed. It's little surprise he didn't throw himself upon their mercy. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-07-02/chief-justice-roberts-is-awesome-power-behind-fisa-court.html http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-07-02/chief-justice-rober...
  - mpyne 13y ago
    The Supreme Court did rule in favor of Ellsberg, it ruled in favor of the New York Times, and later in favor of the Congressman who added the Pentagon Papers to the Congressional Record. Likewise Nixon had nothing to do it. He didn't even lift a finger against Ellsberg until Kissinger convinced him that he had to do so for the integrity of his Office. And even if Nixon really was pushing for it, judicial cases don't reset upon a President leaving office. Ellsberg's case was thrown out on a technicality, as I recall, not due to any forebearance on the part of the Executive branch. > Snowden's situation is different, the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court is the one who also appoints the judges to the secret FISA court Snowden has exposed. It's little surprise he didn't throw himself upon their mercy. I wasn't aware that Roberts counted for all 9 votes now.
    - marshray 13y ago
      Looks like Ellsberg himself has now said it better than I could: "Snowden made the right call when he fled the U.S." http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/daniel-ellsberg-nsa-leaker-snowden-made-the-right-call/2013/07/07/0b46d96c-e5b7-11e2-aef3-339619eab080_story.html http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/daniel-ellsberg-nsa-l...

mpyne 13y ago

> Ellsberg wasn't fighting secret courts and secret interpretations of law. Indeed, he was fighting something even worse: a secret conspiracy spanning multiple Presidencies to help force a nation's involvement in war. Nixon took the unprecedented step of suing to stop the publication of the newspapers that were going to print the Pentagon Papers, even though the topics described didn't even occur on his watch. What Ellsberg was dealing in was far more serious, and yet he turned out OK when he turned himself in.

marshray 13y ago
I don't dispute that what Ellsberg did was brave and ultimately the system worked. But it literally took having the Supreme Court rule in his favor and the President thrown out of office (a once ever in 237 years event). Snowden's situation is different, the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court is the one who also appoints the judges to the secret FISA court Snowden has exposed. It's little surprise he didn't throw himself upon their mercy. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-07-02/chief-justice-roberts-is-awesome-power-behind-fisa-court.html http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-07-02/chief-justice-rober...
- mpyne 13y ago
  The Supreme Court did rule in favor of Ellsberg, it ruled in favor of the New York Times, and later in favor of the Congressman who added the Pentagon Papers to the Congressional Record. Likewise Nixon had nothing to do it. He didn't even lift a finger against Ellsberg until Kissinger convinced him that he had to do so for the integrity of his Office. And even if Nixon really was pushing for it, judicial cases don't reset upon a President leaving office. Ellsberg's case was thrown out on a technicality, as I recall, not due to any forebearance on the part of the Executive branch. > Snowden's situation is different, the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court is the one who also appoints the judges to the secret FISA court Snowden has exposed. It's little surprise he didn't throw himself upon their mercy. I wasn't aware that Roberts counted for all 9 votes now.
  - marshray 13y ago
    Looks like Ellsberg himself has now said it better than I could: "Snowden made the right call when he fled the U.S." http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/daniel-ellsberg-nsa-leaker-snowden-made-the-right-call/2013/07/07/0b46d96c-e5b7-11e2-aef3-339619eab080_story.html http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/daniel-ellsberg-nsa-l...