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EU Parliament supports the possible suspension of U.S. data sharing agreements
- michielvoo 13y agoBut EC is not suspending any data sharing deals (yet), which could have huge economic effects since it could mean that flights to the US are grounded. But it is my understanding that the US would be the one that would order flights to be grounded if the EU no longer meets the requirements of the data sharing agreement.
- smackay 13y agoYou know, I'd really like to see what would happen when "push came to shove". It would either tear-off the fig-leaf of terrorism or the rest of the world would really understand that the US government has developed into a paranoid, frightened, bully. However, more likely is that some deal would be struck (behind closed doors, of course) that would allow business to continue as usual - shutting down most if not all transatlantic commerce would be a gargantuan step for anyone to take. I don't think that would change the long term direction this issue is heading in though. We're either going to end up with court supervised limited snooping and more transparent governments or an all-pervasive surveillance state where absolutely everything is going to be hoovered up and stored for later use. UPDATE: One of the goals of the European Union is to avoid war on the continent. With the road of economic and political integration riddled with pot-holes of various sizes perhaps the new direction to unite everybody is personal freedom - freedom of movement, freedom of speech, etc. Europe certainly has the history to justify why these are laudable goals. With partner countries such as Iceland (which has Europe's longest running parliament) showing the necessary leadership, the time has come for Old Europe to become Bold Europe.
- Svip 13y ago> the time has come for Old Europe to become Bold Europe I like that. But understanding Iceland's position is important. Iceland is due to its position, natural resources and political influence extremely free to do what it likes without threatening its diplomatic relationships. Iceland can effectively 'show the necessary leadership' because they have little or nothing to lose, at least not as much as their European countries. In addition, Iceland has been blessed (although not currently) with a rather progressive political environment. Other European countries are unfortunately not so lucky, and they are afraid to risk too much of it by being bold. However, if the European countries gather together to be bold, then the risk is vastly reduced. But of course, this is one of the purposes of the EU; alone we are weak, together we are strong.
- pcrh 13y ago>Old Europe to become Bold Europe. The country most likely to lead any such move would be Germany; Germans are today extremely well-inoculated against disingenuous reassurances by governments.
- 1337biz 13y agoPutting Germany and bold in a sentence seems still to go down badly across many European nations. Some might even suggest that (the/a) purpose of the European idea was to keep a reunified Germany from going bold again.
- claudius 13y agoThat worked rather, uh, well: http://www.economist.com/blogs/easternapproaches/2011/11/polands-appeal-germany http://www.economist.com/blogs/easternapproaches/2011/11/pol... On the other hand, it works relatively well if you only consider going to war against each other within Europe, which definitely was the main concern in the 1950s. How peaceful this united Europe is towards other countries is another question altogether – again resorting to history does not necessarily offer hope.
- pcrh 13y agoI was thinking more along the lines of the relationship between Google streetview and Germany [1]. I feel (albeit without evidence) that German citizens are more likely than those of the other major EU countries to pressure their government and the EU parliament to introduce legislation that would forbid the storage and mining of private communications prior to any warrants being issued. [1]http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/04/23/germanys-complicated-relationship-with-google-street-view/ http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/04/23/germanys-complicate...
- Dewie 13y agoWhat, really? Is there really a tangible fear that Germany would blow up in everyones faces again, still today?
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- tommi 13y agoGood news albeit won't make a big difference for United States. Let's get rid of the SWIFT data sharing while we are it, it's not U.S.'s business.
- contingencies 13y agoThis. Also, passenger name record (PNR) information on international carriers where the origin or destination are not the government in question.
- flyinRyan 13y agoGet rid of all the financial data passing to the US! Fuck them, they were the absolute worst player in the financial crisis. How dare they demand that everyone send them all the details of almost all financial dealings.
- tehwalrus 13y agoGood. I'm also glad they're investigating the criminality of the UK government - I had assumed they would get away with it, rather like extraordinary rendition, because they didn't take the data directly. A big fat fine for Westminster could be just what the doctor ordered here (and I say that as a UK taxpayer.) Now we just need similar investigations into the NSA under the 4th Amendment - I wonder what the US is waiting for...
- arethuza 13y agoOn the subject of extraordinary rendition, I was glad to see an announcement earlier this year that Scottish police are investigating the use of airports in Scotland for CIA flights: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-22788443 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-2278... I doubt if it will come to anything, but the idea that we had prisoners who were on their way to be tortured transported through our country and we did nothing about it make my blood boil.
- tehwalrus 13y agoOne of the few places where I support the death penalty is for "international crimes" - genocide, crimes against humanity, etc. I think official sanction of torture should be on that list too. This puts me in the odd position when the weirdos call "bring back hanging" of saying "yes, but only for politicians."
- alan_cx 13y agoNo. The death penalty is wrong, end of. I dont care who we are talking about, if it is wrong to kill, then it is wrong to kill. That has to be n absolute or we just get mission creep in the application of the law. And you know what happens, juniors get to shoulder the blame while the people at the top get away with it. Ever seen a rich powerful person get the death penalty in a western democracy? Look at the US. Its pretty much all economically poor minorities on death row. No politicians, businessmen, bankers, senior military officers, just poor people. I understand your motivation, I "feel" the same way, but I have to disagree with any one who supports the death penalty, for any reason. It is wrong. And for me, that is an absolute. Put it this way, are you prepared for you, your partner, or children to die at the hands of a court in a miscarriage of justice? Are you prepared to even risk that? Do you trust the system enough top gamble your own life or that of your loved ones? Yeah, politicians and associated scum are humans as well.......... unfortunately.
- eliasmacpherson 13y agoYesterday, whether this vote would pass was in serious doubt. Now the doubt remains whether it will be put into effect.
- freetibet 13y agoWhile we are at it let's have the US stop funding the EU's defense and use the savings to fund healthcare. It won't be great for Europe in the near term but they really need to be self sufficient eventually.
- iuguy 13y agoPlease note that this is not that the EU supports suspending data sharing agreements, this is simply that the parliament will support it if the EC supports, which it probably won't.
- Fuxy 13y agoThey took their sweet time i was beginning to think their all a bunch of pussies. I'm all in favor of this even if it puts European citizens in a slightly difficult situation with some potential jobs on the line. Europe needs to have boundaries and spying on its citizens should be unacceptable.
- wwhitman 13y agoHopefully this will make it easy for the US to stop paying for defense of the EU and spend that money at home.
- richtr 13y agoDo you have any sources for this bizarre statement? Today, any excessive US presence in Europe is most likely a symptom of over-reaching US Foreign Policy rather than something the EU requires.
- wwhitman 13y agoFine, then we can close all EU bases, save a ton of money and you can defend your own shipping routes, I'm sure you will be fine.
- claudius 13y agoMost trade of European countries is internal to Europe, and the few relevant external trading partners are the US (no pirates in the Atlantic…apart from Iceland, maybe ;)), Russia, China and Japan. Of course the problem of pirates around Somalia is an actual problem, but not one requiring the ‘defence of the EU’ by the US. Similarly, while Russia might not be too fond of an expanding EU, a lot has to happen for Russian tanks to roll west and threaten the largest customers of their oil and gas. And if all else fails, the ‘Grande Nation’ is still a nuclear power quite capable of defending itself and its close economical allies, even if the guys across the channel would rather become the 51st state of the US.
- shubb 13y agoUS bases outside of America are vital to the US if it wants to operate on other continents[1]. The bases in Germany for instance were used for medical care of casualties from Iraq and Afganistan. It's fair to say that without such bases, the US probably could not operate in the way it does. The US has aquirred it's bases for different historic reasons. Some, in the pacific, were leased off the UK for money. Others, like the bases in Japan and Germany, were forced on countries that lost a war with the US, and as few who fought in or supported that war are still alive, you can see why those countries might consider whether they benefit from them. It is hard to separate beneficial activities that the US does, like the protection of shipping as it travels past East Africa, from it's pursuit of strategic objectives, such as rivalry for dominance in Africa with the Chinese, and middle eastern power blocks. And in addition, there is a legitimate counter terrorism aspect, which probably benefits the US more than other countries. The thing is that the US had a great deal of control over Western Europe, imposed by force in the 1940s, and declining since then, and this was achieved as part of a struggle between the US and USSR, where European countries were really pawns. As the power declines (in part due to increasing strength and unity between EU countries), it's hard to imagine that the US will be able to maintain it's bases. I think you should try to see it more dispassionately. There is a strategic game, where people lose and win, often in different ways at the same time. As American power declines from it's peak this century, it may be more comfortable to view it as a neccesary horror, rather than America's god appointed role, as a lot of Europeans view their own countries real politique. [1] http://blog.heritage.org/2013/04/26/u-s-military-bases-in-europe-are-vital-to-americas-security/ http://blog.heritage.org/2013/04/26/u-s-military-bases-in-eu...
- seferphier 13y agoThis is great. Finally some consequence to NSA's actions against the government directly given that all the checks and balances are not working. For example: There are now secret courts and secret judgments that lacks binding power (NSA ignores them anyways). Despite the media revealing more and more lies, the congress does not seem to care (half of them did not attend the NSA talks). The rest that do have little power to stop them or even talk about them at all.
- diminoten 13y agoCongress doesn't care because most Americans don't care. We want our government to do these things.
- leke 13y agoThe UK warn that closing trade negotiations could cause the loss of over 400,000 jobs, but must also realise due to corporate spying, it might have cost the UK much more than 400,000 jobs.
- ra 13y ago"Should the Commission decide it necessary to suspend the data sharing agreement of passenger details — including personal and sensitive individual data — it could ultimately lead to the grounding of flights between the EU and the U.S." It's simply not going to happen.
- ipsin 13y agoIt's worth noting that this is a non-binding resolution, in case it wasn't clear from the article's title: "the Commission now has the authority from the Parliament to suspend PNR and TFTP, but it falls at the Commission's discretion. Resolutions passed by the Parliament are not legally binding,"
- nhaehnle 13y agoThis is a very important point. Democracy is really lacking at a European level, and a large part of that is that the Parliament has almost no real power. Whether it is sufficient to give the EU Parliament real power is questionable, but if the EU is to become a proper democracy, then giving real power to the parliament is at least necessary.
- thomasjames 13y agoIs the irony of this not lost on anyone else? In light of recent events it appears they'll be able to get the data anyway, whether or not it is sent over.
- Qantourisc 13y agoGood to hear something good from the EU !
- schoash 13y agothey are only supporting? They should immediately cancel them.