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But you are clearly covering topics that XorNot did not mention. He specifically stated disliking the syntax and having to type it. I would agree with you that

by talmand 13y ago

But you are clearly covering topics that XorNot did not mention. He specifically stated disliking the syntax and having to type it. I would agree with you that over the years people have pushed features into HTML beyond what it was originally intended for, but that's not what's being discussed.

XorNot 13y ago
Simply put: <p>some text</p> involves more awkward use of the right-side of my keyboard then there's any need for it to. Contrast to Jade where I would just go: p some text and let the indentation sort out the DOM structure. It's simple, readable, and doesn't overuse a set of keys placed more or less to be used infrequently (the <> brackets). All this translates to more productivity. CSS is different problems, but it still stems from being overly verbose (too many vendor tags to worry about) and lacking useful functions, interators etc. Basically CSS sans a preprocessor is just slow and clumsy to work in.