11 ms·

I feel the same way about everything MS has produced/is planning on producing in the near future. IE, Windows 8, Xbox One, Microsoft Office, the list just goes

I feel the same way about everything MS has produced/is planning on producing in the near future. IE, Windows 8, Xbox One, Microsoft Office, the list just goes on.

sixothree 13y ago
Everything about Windows 8 to me just feels like a kick in the groin from Microsoft. For many years now they've claimed that .Net was the present and future of Microsoft development; yet it seems they've shoved it into the back seat and likely next into the trunk of deprecation.
- Already__Taken 13y ago
  How'd you work that out? .Net is the hook to get people to take powershell seriously. But I'm no Microsoft developer.
- pjmlp 13y ago
  There was lots of cool .NET stuff to see at BUILD 2013, not sure what you mean.
  - kryten 13y ago
    There was no cool stuff. They fixed a load of stuff, threw new versions out and spun it as marketing. It's not cool if you have to pay for it at a rapidly growing pace.
    - pjmlp 13y ago
      Visual Studio does have quite a few improvements, specially in what concerns debugging asynchronous code and DirectX. Unity is now a first class citizen for development of games on Windows. Windows 8.1 brings quite a few new APIs, better interaction with .NET projections. JIT, GC and ASP.NET improvements. The message is, they could have thrown a RSS Reader attitude to .NET, instead they are paying developers to fix those issues. As for paying for stuff, welcome to the commercial world. Microsoft is not the only vendor selling developer tools, although it looks like that when reading HN. With MSDN subscriptions you get lots of those things for "free" for the timeframe the subscription is valid.
      - kryten 13y ago
        I am an MSDN subscriber as are the other 100 people we employ. Definitely not free. Really don't care about Windows 8.1 APIs. The only thing that concerns me is web and WPF Desktop apps in C# as that's what powers my industry. Compare to the Java EE ecosystem. Costing: IDE - free (Eclipse/NetBeans) Server - free (GlassFish/Tomcat on Ubuntu) Database - free (PostgreSQL on Ubuntu). Not only that, your profiler, code review, automated build, version control and testing platforms are also 100% free compared to DotTrace, TFS etc.
        pjmlp 13y ago
        > I am an MSDN subscriber as are the other 100 people we employ. Definitely not free. It is a matter of scale. The type of companies I work for, the MSDN subscription is done at enterprise level. Sure it is expensive, but still cheaper than buying individual products, and gives the liberty to access new software versions. It feels as if it was free, hence my quotes around free. > Compare to the Java EE ecosystem. True, in many things the Java ecosystem is more open source friendly, because the money comes from consulting or selling books, not from direct sale of tooling. Ever tried to develop Eclipse Ecore plugins without buying the books from Eclipse Foundation? I am fully aware of it, my employer was a Java/C++ shop until 2009, date when we started delivery .NET solutions additionally. On the world consulting world my employer targets, there are lots of commercial tools to chose from, Websphere, Weblogic, Oracle DB, Informix, DB2, Rational Rose, Clearcase, Intel C++, Intel VTune, Portland Group Fortran/C/C++, InteliJ, Delphi, Together, Sybase, HP-UX, Solaris, ...
- nwilliams 13y ago
  > For many years now they've claimed that .Net was the present and future of Microsoft development And then the iPad and post-PC era happened, killing Silverlight in the process and PC sales are still in steady decline.
- sageikosa 13y ago
  I'm with you. I've been an aficionado of WPF and WCF since day 1, and am always hoping that with every version WPF would get enhanced just a little closer to the DirectX wire, not completely replaced by that stunted Windows 8 XAML junk.

I feel the same way about everything MS has produced/is planning on producing in the near future. IE, Windows 8, Xbox One, Microsoft Office, the list just goes on.

sixothree 13y ago

Everything about Windows 8 to me just feels like a kick in the groin from Microsoft. For many years now they've claimed that .Net was the present and future of Microsoft development; yet it seems they've shoved it into the back seat and likely next into the trunk of deprecation.

Already__Taken 13y ago
How'd you work that out? .Net is the hook to get people to take powershell seriously. But I'm no Microsoft developer.
pjmlp 13y ago
There was lots of cool .NET stuff to see at BUILD 2013, not sure what you mean.
- kryten 13y ago
  There was no cool stuff. They fixed a load of stuff, threw new versions out and spun it as marketing. It's not cool if you have to pay for it at a rapidly growing pace.
  - pjmlp 13y ago
    Visual Studio does have quite a few improvements, specially in what concerns debugging asynchronous code and DirectX. Unity is now a first class citizen for development of games on Windows. Windows 8.1 brings quite a few new APIs, better interaction with .NET projections. JIT, GC and ASP.NET improvements. The message is, they could have thrown a RSS Reader attitude to .NET, instead they are paying developers to fix those issues. As for paying for stuff, welcome to the commercial world. Microsoft is not the only vendor selling developer tools, although it looks like that when reading HN. With MSDN subscriptions you get lots of those things for "free" for the timeframe the subscription is valid.
    - kryten 13y ago
      I am an MSDN subscriber as are the other 100 people we employ. Definitely not free. Really don't care about Windows 8.1 APIs. The only thing that concerns me is web and WPF Desktop apps in C# as that's what powers my industry. Compare to the Java EE ecosystem. Costing: IDE - free (Eclipse/NetBeans) Server - free (GlassFish/Tomcat on Ubuntu) Database - free (PostgreSQL on Ubuntu). Not only that, your profiler, code review, automated build, version control and testing platforms are also 100% free compared to DotTrace, TFS etc.
      - pjmlp 13y ago
        > I am an MSDN subscriber as are the other 100 people we employ. Definitely not free. It is a matter of scale. The type of companies I work for, the MSDN subscription is done at enterprise level. Sure it is expensive, but still cheaper than buying individual products, and gives the liberty to access new software versions. It feels as if it was free, hence my quotes around free. > Compare to the Java EE ecosystem. True, in many things the Java ecosystem is more open source friendly, because the money comes from consulting or selling books, not from direct sale of tooling. Ever tried to develop Eclipse Ecore plugins without buying the books from Eclipse Foundation? I am fully aware of it, my employer was a Java/C++ shop until 2009, date when we started delivery .NET solutions additionally. On the world consulting world my employer targets, there are lots of commercial tools to chose from, Websphere, Weblogic, Oracle DB, Informix, DB2, Rational Rose, Clearcase, Intel C++, Intel VTune, Portland Group Fortran/C/C++, InteliJ, Delphi, Together, Sybase, HP-UX, Solaris, ...
nwilliams 13y ago
> For many years now they've claimed that .Net was the present and future of Microsoft development And then the iPad and post-PC era happened, killing Silverlight in the process and PC sales are still in steady decline.
sageikosa 13y ago
I'm with you. I've been an aficionado of WPF and WCF since day 1, and am always hoping that with every version WPF would get enhanced just a little closer to the DirectX wire, not completely replaced by that stunted Windows 8 XAML junk.