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What makes this different from typekit? It's quite a bit more expensive ($99 for 250,000 pageviews on cloud.typography vs $49 for 500,000 on typekit) and I'm wo

What makes this different from typekit? It's quite a bit more expensive ($99 for 250,000 pageviews on cloud.typography vs $49 for 500,000 on typekit) and I'm wondering what extras it provides.

russelluresti 13y ago
It's the same type of service, but H&FJ is their own foundry and none of their fonts were licensed through Typekit. This will, assumedly, be the only place to get H&FJ fonts (which is a big deal for typography nerds).
muglug 13y ago
Hoefler & Frere-Jones typefaces. Their typography foundry is held to be second-to-none among typeface quality and frequency of usage in print and elsewhere. In particular, their typeface Gotham is incredibly popular, and making it available as a webfont publicly is a big deal. Also, this effort has been underway for at least three years. Their attention to detail ensures that these webfonts are going to be some of the best available anywhere.
- mortenjorck 13y ago
  An analogy might be that Typekit is the Netflix of typography, while H&FJ are the HBO of the market. Gotham is Game of Thrones. And this move is the typographic equivalent of making HBO Go available as a standalone subscription.
ctidd 13y ago
It doesn't seem to provide much in the way of competing directly with Typekit. Still, this is big news for a lot of people. H&FJ is practically THE type foundry for original typefaces. They compete on quality rather than price or other tangible benefits. Unfortunately, it's been impossible to license H&FJ type for real web use until now. The most likely group of people who will use this are type enthusiasts who prefer H&FJ type to the competition's. I can predict there are a lot of designers who will use this service for their personal or business sites. As a competitive offering, though, this doesn't cut it. Buying individual fonts feels outdated to web font users, and the prices don't match up to Typekit (free with Adobe CC) or Monotype/Linotype ($10/month without a ridiculous 5 font cap). H&FJ has chosen their business model, and they'd like to avoid the brand dilution of having poorly designed sites overusing their type. It's an interesting choice, and I hope it works out for them.
- tptacek 13y ago
  H+FJ doesn't serve the kind of user who feels that "buying individual fonts feels outdated", or who does price competition in the two digit range between different foundries. Instead, they sell to people for whom any price they could reasonably come up with for this service would be a rounding error. Prior to launching Cloud Typography, H+FJ didn't sell web fonts at all. Things seemed to have been going pretty well for them.
  - ctidd 13y ago
    Of course -- H&FJ is an excellent foundry, and they're not competing in the same space as, say, Google Web fonts. That's what I mean by not competitive. It's a completely different league, as it sounds like you're well aware. The people who like H&FJ for the quality will subscribe and use this service, while those looking for a commodity option will avoid it -- perhaps even to the benefit of H&FJ. I know I'll subscribe shortly, which is why I hope this works for their business. It really is an interesting decision when compared to the providers whose offerings keep dropping in price to compete in a commodity market.
  - Silhouette 13y ago
    H+FJ doesn't serve the kind of user who feels that "buying individual fonts feels outdated", or who does price competition in the two digit range between different foundries. The pricing advertised on their site appears to contradict you. They seem to be aiming for the mainstream market rather than exclusivity, yet their prices are uncompetitive by mainstream standards, which seems an odd strategy.
neilk 13y ago
First of all - a lot of the fonts available on Typekit - actually, anywhere, are, ahem, inspired by H&FJ. This is the first offering that matches the H&FJ to quality. For instance, my favorite font at the moment is Ideal Sans. The concept here is to infuse a sans serif with an almost handlettered quality. There are no straight lines. Consequently it's hard to make it look good for the screen, period, let alone at small sizes. But they've done it. http://www.typography.com/fonts/ideal-sans/overview/ http://www.typography.com/fonts/ideal-sans/overview/ RandsInRepose.com has been beta testing it and it's gotten notably better over the past year, I think.
- muglug 13y ago
  Maybe, but the most popular (Proxima Nova) has roots that predate its doppelganger Gotham (H&FJ's most popular typeface) by six years: http://www.marksimonson.com/notebook/view/first-public-use-of-what-became-proxima-nova http://www.marksimonson.com/notebook/view/first-public-use-o... Nevertheless, its recent popularity is due to its status as best-legal-webfont-alternative to Gotham - at least, until today.
thufry 13y ago
They're not trying to sell this to startups, they're trying to sell this to the Goldman Sachs website. These type of clients: 1) don't want the same fonts as everyone else, 2) want the high-quality typefaces of H&FJ, and 3) don't give a hoot what it costs.

What makes this different from typekit? It's quite a bit more expensive ($99 for 250,000 pageviews on cloud.typography vs $49 for 500,000 on typekit) and I'm wondering what extras it provides.

russelluresti 13y ago

It's the same type of service, but H&FJ is their own foundry and none of their fonts were licensed through Typekit. This will, assumedly, be the only place to get H&FJ fonts (which is a big deal for typography nerds).

muglug 13y ago

Hoefler & Frere-Jones typefaces. Their typography foundry is held to be second-to-none among typeface quality and frequency of usage in print and elsewhere. In particular, their typeface Gotham is incredibly popular, and making it available as a webfont publicly is a big deal. Also, this effort has been underway for at least three years. Their attention to detail ensures that these webfonts are going to be some of the best available anywhere.

mortenjorck 13y ago
An analogy might be that Typekit is the Netflix of typography, while H&FJ are the HBO of the market. Gotham is Game of Thrones. And this move is the typographic equivalent of making HBO Go available as a standalone subscription.

ctidd 13y ago

It doesn't seem to provide much in the way of competing directly with Typekit. Still, this is big news for a lot of people. H&FJ is practically THE type foundry for original typefaces. They compete on quality rather than price or other tangible benefits. Unfortunately, it's been impossible to license H&FJ type for real web use until now. The most likely group of people who will use this are type enthusiasts who prefer H&FJ type to the competition's. I can predict there are a lot of designers who will use this service for their personal or business sites. As a competitive offering, though, this doesn't cut it. Buying individual fonts feels outdated to web font users, and the prices don't match up to Typekit (free with Adobe CC) or Monotype/Linotype ($10/month without a ridiculous 5 font cap). H&FJ has chosen their business model, and they'd like to avoid the brand dilution of having poorly designed sites overusing their type. It's an interesting choice, and I hope it works out for them.

tptacek 13y ago
H+FJ doesn't serve the kind of user who feels that "buying individual fonts feels outdated", or who does price competition in the two digit range between different foundries. Instead, they sell to people for whom any price they could reasonably come up with for this service would be a rounding error. Prior to launching Cloud Typography, H+FJ didn't sell web fonts at all. Things seemed to have been going pretty well for them.
- ctidd 13y ago
  Of course -- H&FJ is an excellent foundry, and they're not competing in the same space as, say, Google Web fonts. That's what I mean by not competitive. It's a completely different league, as it sounds like you're well aware. The people who like H&FJ for the quality will subscribe and use this service, while those looking for a commodity option will avoid it -- perhaps even to the benefit of H&FJ. I know I'll subscribe shortly, which is why I hope this works for their business. It really is an interesting decision when compared to the providers whose offerings keep dropping in price to compete in a commodity market.
- Silhouette 13y ago
  H+FJ doesn't serve the kind of user who feels that "buying individual fonts feels outdated", or who does price competition in the two digit range between different foundries. The pricing advertised on their site appears to contradict you. They seem to be aiming for the mainstream market rather than exclusivity, yet their prices are uncompetitive by mainstream standards, which seems an odd strategy.

neilk 13y ago

First of all - a lot of the fonts available on Typekit - actually, anywhere, are, ahem, inspired by H&FJ. This is the first offering that matches the H&FJ to quality. For instance, my favorite font at the moment is Ideal Sans. The concept here is to infuse a sans serif with an almost handlettered quality. There are no straight lines. Consequently it's hard to make it look good for the screen, period, let alone at small sizes. But they've done it. http://www.typography.com/fonts/ideal-sans/overview/ http://www.typography.com/fonts/ideal-sans/overview/ RandsInRepose.com has been beta testing it and it's gotten notably better over the past year, I think.

muglug 13y ago
Maybe, but the most popular (Proxima Nova) has roots that predate its doppelganger Gotham (H&FJ's most popular typeface) by six years: http://www.marksimonson.com/notebook/view/first-public-use-of-what-became-proxima-nova http://www.marksimonson.com/notebook/view/first-public-use-o... Nevertheless, its recent popularity is due to its status as best-legal-webfont-alternative to Gotham - at least, until today.

thufry 13y ago

They're not trying to sell this to startups, they're trying to sell this to the Goldman Sachs website. These type of clients: 1) don't want the same fonts as everyone else, 2) want the high-quality typefaces of H&FJ, and 3) don't give a hoot what it costs.