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> having a large buffer between them and germany You sound like you're stuck in 1982. The biggest geo-political headache for Putin is not maintaining a useless

> having a large buffer between them and germany You sound like you're stuck in 1982. The biggest geo-political headache for Putin is not maintaining a useless "buffer" with Western Europe, but the growing Chinese influence in the East. Look at the map: the soon-to-be superpower shares a fairly huge border with Russia with precedents of isolated clashes in the 60s. And there are no buffers to "dominate". Germany, on the other hand, sends their ex-chancellors to work for Russian natural gas giants: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerhard_Schr%C3%B6der#Gazprom http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerhard_Schr%C3%B6der#Gazprom

kposehn 13y ago
> You sound like you're stuck in 1982 No, look at Russia's geopolitical moves since the 1800's all the way until today. They have a buffer with China already called Siberia. And yes, they are concerned about China anyway (as well they should be).
- jacalata 13y ago
  Siberia is in the north of Russia. Are you thinking of Mongolia? There is also a direct china-Russia border on the east.
  - kposehn 13y ago
    I'm referring to the region east of the Urals, primarily along the southern frontier. Pretty much just west of Baikal to the Pacific. That is often considered Siberia as a whole, though more local definitions I'm not aware of may define it differently.
    - jacalata 13y ago
      Looks like there are several definitions I'm not aware of, including 'the entire eastern two thirds of Russia'. Interesting!
- old-gregg 13y ago
  That's where I grew up. I can assure you, nobody in Russia sees its own territory hosting multiple critical industries with half a dozen cities with >1M population as a "buffer" against China. "Siberia" is not a well-defined region, BTW, kind of like "Wild Wild West" in the US - more like a general direction they used to send expeditions to, like 200 years ago. Just pointing out how weird your comment seems. Either you're trolling, or your mental picture of that part of the world needs an overhaul.
  - kposehn 13y ago
    The heartland of Russia is west of the Urals. While Siberia has a ton of value, it is also a buffer. The Ukraine & Belarus are the same. Think about it this way - how is China going to go rolling into Moscow? By holding Siberia, they have an effective buffer against incursion into the most valuable parts of the country. > That's where I grew up. Whereabouts? I'm honestly curious as to your experience in Russia and what it was like. > Either you're trolling, or your mental picture of that part of the world needs an overhaul. No to both. Why would I be trolling? To me this is a discussion and I'd like to know more about your viewpoint.
    - old-gregg 13y ago
      Why would China want to go rolling into Moscow? It's full of people and has nothing to offer to a conquerer. A much more practical trophy would be something like Sakhalin island! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sakhalin#Economy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sakhalin#Economy The point I am trying to make is that Russia is not an aggressor. They're facing the opposite challenge: too much land, too many resources and the shrinking population. They see the raise of China in the East and the threat of islamic fundamentalism in the South. Why on earth would they think of attacking Germany under these circumstances? If anything, Russians have expected the West to become their partner dealing with those challenges, first after the collapse of the Soviet Union, and especially after the 9/11. But the continuing Cold War era rhetorics and missile deployment plans in those stupid "buffers" make it easy to understand why Putin is disillusioned and annoyed with the West.

kposehn 13y ago

> You sound like you're stuck in 1982 No, look at Russia's geopolitical moves since the 1800's all the way until today. They have a buffer with China already called Siberia. And yes, they are concerned about China anyway (as well they should be).

jacalata 13y ago
Siberia is in the north of Russia. Are you thinking of Mongolia? There is also a direct china-Russia border on the east.
- kposehn 13y ago
  I'm referring to the region east of the Urals, primarily along the southern frontier. Pretty much just west of Baikal to the Pacific. That is often considered Siberia as a whole, though more local definitions I'm not aware of may define it differently.
  - jacalata 13y ago
    Looks like there are several definitions I'm not aware of, including 'the entire eastern two thirds of Russia'. Interesting!
old-gregg 13y ago
That's where I grew up. I can assure you, nobody in Russia sees its own territory hosting multiple critical industries with half a dozen cities with >1M population as a "buffer" against China. "Siberia" is not a well-defined region, BTW, kind of like "Wild Wild West" in the US - more like a general direction they used to send expeditions to, like 200 years ago. Just pointing out how weird your comment seems. Either you're trolling, or your mental picture of that part of the world needs an overhaul.
- kposehn 13y ago
  The heartland of Russia is west of the Urals. While Siberia has a ton of value, it is also a buffer. The Ukraine & Belarus are the same. Think about it this way - how is China going to go rolling into Moscow? By holding Siberia, they have an effective buffer against incursion into the most valuable parts of the country. > That's where I grew up. Whereabouts? I'm honestly curious as to your experience in Russia and what it was like. > Either you're trolling, or your mental picture of that part of the world needs an overhaul. No to both. Why would I be trolling? To me this is a discussion and I'd like to know more about your viewpoint.
  - old-gregg 13y ago
    Why would China want to go rolling into Moscow? It's full of people and has nothing to offer to a conquerer. A much more practical trophy would be something like Sakhalin island! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sakhalin#Economy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sakhalin#Economy The point I am trying to make is that Russia is not an aggressor. They're facing the opposite challenge: too much land, too many resources and the shrinking population. They see the raise of China in the East and the threat of islamic fundamentalism in the South. Why on earth would they think of attacking Germany under these circumstances? If anything, Russians have expected the West to become their partner dealing with those challenges, first after the collapse of the Soviet Union, and especially after the 9/11. But the continuing Cold War era rhetorics and missile deployment plans in those stupid "buffers" make it easy to understand why Putin is disillusioned and annoyed with the West.