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That's why I did this; https://github.com/etherael/phoneme https://github.com/etherael/phoneme It's not perfect, but I think the first step to widespread cryp

That's why I did this; https://github.com/etherael/phoneme https://github.com/etherael/phoneme It's not perfect, but I think the first step to widespread crypto adoption is getting people accustomed to the workflow of fully encrypted email. Phoneme + mailvelope is not a huge jump from the current gmail experience and just that initial taste might be enough to get more people on the right track.

dlss 13y ago
Cool project, you seem talented... I'm just a bit confused here. If we basically know several governments already have copies of your historical gmails, and you're not securing the incoming channel (which we basically know has a beam splitter on it), what good does encrypting the historical files do?
- etherael 13y ago
  We don't know for certain that several governments have archived stored copies of all cloud based email in existence, it's hazy as to what they do and do not have access to, what isn't hazy is that they have the right to demand the content of any given gmail account with effectively zero recourse available. The very fact that they actually do make these demands indicates on balance of probability, they don't actually just have an archived permanent copy of the content of every gmail account in existence. Why ask for what you already have? Of course, that's an assumption and it may be incorrect. However on the downside if it is incorrect, you're back in the exact same position you started in and you've lost nothing anyway. And as previously stated, it might get people in the habit of understanding how PGP works if mailvelope and products like it see wider adoption. In a network of correspondents where everyone is running something similar to mailvelope + phoneme, it becomes an obvious thing to do to simply implement proper end to end PGP, so I also hope it might be a solution to the chicken and egg problem which has plagued PGP deployment for so long. It can never hurt to fight, even if you might lose, especially when if you don't fight, you'll definitely lose.
  - mverwijs 13y ago
    I was hoping someone far more talented than me would write a browser plugin that would encrypt everything I type in a TEXTAREA with GPG, and then prompt me for a list of friends I'd like to have read that text. Everything, from Facebook to Gmail, would be encrypted that way. And I would be in control of the list of people that could read that text.
    - sp332 13y ago
      Wouldn't you have to encrypt the text repeatedly, once for each recipient?
      - reeses 13y ago
        gpg handles this natively. http://www.gnupg.org/gph/en/manual.html#AEN111 http://www.gnupg.org/gph/en/manual.html#AEN111 "multiparty encryption" is what you're looking for.
    - reeses 13y ago
      This is a solved problem, including the problem that you're haven't anticipated, which is the helpful "autosave" of drafts. http://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/Edit_with_Emacs http://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/Edit_with_Emacs I'm sure something similar exists for vi, sublime, etc., but emacs (of course) has great gpg support (http://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/EasyPG http://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/EasyPG). This moves the burden to your local machine, which, while not guaranteeing privacy, helps reduce the amount of data that you're just handing to the bastards.
      - mverwijs 13y ago
        Hardly solved. I want it to be so simple the average Facebook user will want to use it. Emacs hardly fits that bill. Nor does popping up any other editor I think. I would just like to use the native browser interface and right before doing a POST, have the browser do a pop up and ask me which of my friends I would like to share the text with.
deadairspace 13y ago
Is that supposed to be read as "phone me" or "phoneme"?
- etherael 13y ago
  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phoneme http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phoneme

dlss 13y ago

Cool project, you seem talented... I'm just a bit confused here. If we basically know several governments already have copies of your historical gmails, and you're not securing the incoming channel (which we basically know has a beam splitter on it), what good does encrypting the historical files do?

etherael 13y ago
We don't know for certain that several governments have archived stored copies of all cloud based email in existence, it's hazy as to what they do and do not have access to, what isn't hazy is that they have the right to demand the content of any given gmail account with effectively zero recourse available. The very fact that they actually do make these demands indicates on balance of probability, they don't actually just have an archived permanent copy of the content of every gmail account in existence. Why ask for what you already have? Of course, that's an assumption and it may be incorrect. However on the downside if it is incorrect, you're back in the exact same position you started in and you've lost nothing anyway. And as previously stated, it might get people in the habit of understanding how PGP works if mailvelope and products like it see wider adoption. In a network of correspondents where everyone is running something similar to mailvelope + phoneme, it becomes an obvious thing to do to simply implement proper end to end PGP, so I also hope it might be a solution to the chicken and egg problem which has plagued PGP deployment for so long. It can never hurt to fight, even if you might lose, especially when if you don't fight, you'll definitely lose.
- mverwijs 13y ago
  I was hoping someone far more talented than me would write a browser plugin that would encrypt everything I type in a TEXTAREA with GPG, and then prompt me for a list of friends I'd like to have read that text. Everything, from Facebook to Gmail, would be encrypted that way. And I would be in control of the list of people that could read that text.
  - sp332 13y ago
    Wouldn't you have to encrypt the text repeatedly, once for each recipient?
    - reeses 13y ago
      gpg handles this natively. http://www.gnupg.org/gph/en/manual.html#AEN111 http://www.gnupg.org/gph/en/manual.html#AEN111 "multiparty encryption" is what you're looking for.
  - reeses 13y ago
    This is a solved problem, including the problem that you're haven't anticipated, which is the helpful "autosave" of drafts. http://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/Edit_with_Emacs http://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/Edit_with_Emacs I'm sure something similar exists for vi, sublime, etc., but emacs (of course) has great gpg support (http://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/EasyPG http://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/EasyPG). This moves the burden to your local machine, which, while not guaranteeing privacy, helps reduce the amount of data that you're just handing to the bastards.
    - mverwijs 13y ago
      Hardly solved. I want it to be so simple the average Facebook user will want to use it. Emacs hardly fits that bill. Nor does popping up any other editor I think. I would just like to use the native browser interface and right before doing a POST, have the browser do a pop up and ask me which of my friends I would like to share the text with.

deadairspace 13y ago

Is that supposed to be read as "phone me" or "phoneme"?

etherael 13y ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phoneme http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phoneme