5 ms·

Think of the lost potential of the people who may still be the cream of the crop but just outside the 2%. The logical part of me says that they should be build

Think of the lost potential of the people who may still be the cream of the crop but just outside the 2%. The logical part of me says that they should be building more of these academies (if they can without sacrificing quality).

chetanahuja 13y ago
They are building more as well as converting some of the existing non-IIT engineering schools to IIT status. More than 20 years ago when I took the IIT, the total number of students admitted was much lower (~ 2000) than the article states for today (~10000). That would seem like a 5 fold increase in number of seats in about 20 years. Definitely much faster rate of growth than the rate of population growth in India. Also, people who are just outside that 2% mostly do fine. There are a number of other highly competitive (and pretty good) schools of sciences and engineering that are not IIT's and most of the people you are talking about (smart, motivated students who had a bad day at the test or such), do end up with good careers regardless.
- fakeer 13y ago
  ||who had a bad day at the test or such Or failed to grok the fact that they shall mostly have to do away with those 3-4 years of their lives outside studies. Or failed to understand that "you want to get into an IIT, you have to study Chemistry[1] - by rot, by repetition or by whatever it is required or take the refund and go home or to an NIT[2]".[3] Sort of feels bad. That the curriculum and exam pattern(the core of it) is still the same it was like 50 years ago and then it's life. You learn to deal with it and accept the failure or rather the fact that I was not supposed to be what I am today via that route. My only regret as of now is the grand campus life I missed. Nothing else. [1]Replace this with any subject that a particular doesn't like or is not interested in or hates(I did) [2]This is where I passed out from finally [3]A Bansal faculty member told me this when I went there after my +2 and failing at JEE(as a fresher), not clearing Chem cut-off - he said my overall score would have put me somewhere around 400-500 AIR if it was not for Chemistry. Well, I didn't take the refund and lost another INR 70K.
- rurounijones 13y ago
  The problem I see is not to do with the education but the whole "I went to an IIT" leg-up that people get (Like ivy-leagers). Just seems extremely unfair that the social outcome for getting into an IIT is so different for people of almost identical intellectual capability.
  - chetanahuja 13y ago
    Just seems extremely unfair that the social outcome for getting into an IIT is so different for people of almost identical intellectual capability. Unless you could quote a proper scientific study, that seems like a highly unsupportable assertion. Just anecdotally, I know multiple people who chose not to go to IIT despite being inside the cut-off for one reason or another (e.g., not having a high enough rank to get into their preferred line of study) who've gone on to have extremely good careers nonetheless. Although admittedly, I'm struggling to think of any IIT graduates who did not end up with a solid to brilliant career, regardless of their actual academic performance while at IIT. Some to my great surprise! So what I'm saying is... there's not enough data to make a statement like you did.
  - th3iedkid 13y ago
    Given today's scenario the quality of engineers is dipping.So does the gap and thus even a decently meritorious engineer looks much better than the rest of the crowd.An old study http://careers.learnhub.com/news/544-90-percent-graduates-and-75-percent-engineers-are-unemployable-nasscom http://careers.learnhub.com/news/544-90-percent-graduates-an... shows how poor the rest of the colleges are.That said the socioeconomic gap keeps widening and thus opinions.Opinions are hard to break lest someone disprove.Vast majority of indian IT companies still run aptitude test to figure out who squares out a big number faster and cracks the tell-tale puzzle quicker rather who can understand the system and engineer better.So are their parent's prioties:education is BIG investment and they only want returns not knowledge.Well then these IT companies pay for a 12 hour code/test/typo job!And these companies are PRESTIGIOUS in india!!
    - chetanahuja 13y ago
      I'm finding it hard to decipher the point you're trying to make other than the fact that you're dissatisfied with... uhh... things in India. No argument there. I am too. The discussion at hand was about the small set of people who perhaps have the capability to get into IIT's but for various reasons don't manage to get in the top 2% in that particular test. I asserted that such people end up in other decent colleges (and there are plenty of good ones outside of the IIT system and they still form only a fraction of the sum total of Engineering education in India) and generally tend to end up in good to great careers. Any opinions on that discussion ?
rgovind 13y ago
You are right about smart people outside the 2%. IITs own study says that entrance exam marks vary by 1 or 2 for ranks between 2000 and 10000 The govt has recently opened 10+ new IITs. I think they should add many more..though.
NTDF 13y ago
As a person just outside the 2% (yes, I failed those entrance exams) and yet currently residing in Silicon Valley, I disagree. I would much rather preserve the sanctity of those few colleges. I'd rather have other universities collaborate/compete with the IITs. Not very different from how CMU is competing with IVY league universities here.

chetanahuja 13y ago

They are building more as well as converting some of the existing non-IIT engineering schools to IIT status. More than 20 years ago when I took the IIT, the total number of students admitted was much lower (~ 2000) than the article states for today (~10000). That would seem like a 5 fold increase in number of seats in about 20 years. Definitely much faster rate of growth than the rate of population growth in India. Also, people who are just outside that 2% mostly do fine. There are a number of other highly competitive (and pretty good) schools of sciences and engineering that are not IIT's and most of the people you are talking about (smart, motivated students who had a bad day at the test or such), do end up with good careers regardless.

fakeer 13y ago
||who had a bad day at the test or such Or failed to grok the fact that they shall mostly have to do away with those 3-4 years of their lives outside studies. Or failed to understand that "you want to get into an IIT, you have to study Chemistry[1] - by rot, by repetition or by whatever it is required or take the refund and go home or to an NIT[2]".[3] Sort of feels bad. That the curriculum and exam pattern(the core of it) is still the same it was like 50 years ago and then it's life. You learn to deal with it and accept the failure or rather the fact that I was not supposed to be what I am today via that route. My only regret as of now is the grand campus life I missed. Nothing else. [1]Replace this with any subject that a particular doesn't like or is not interested in or hates(I did) [2]This is where I passed out from finally [3]A Bansal faculty member told me this when I went there after my +2 and failing at JEE(as a fresher), not clearing Chem cut-off - he said my overall score would have put me somewhere around 400-500 AIR if it was not for Chemistry. Well, I didn't take the refund and lost another INR 70K.
rurounijones 13y ago
The problem I see is not to do with the education but the whole "I went to an IIT" leg-up that people get (Like ivy-leagers). Just seems extremely unfair that the social outcome for getting into an IIT is so different for people of almost identical intellectual capability.
- chetanahuja 13y ago
  Just seems extremely unfair that the social outcome for getting into an IIT is so different for people of almost identical intellectual capability. Unless you could quote a proper scientific study, that seems like a highly unsupportable assertion. Just anecdotally, I know multiple people who chose not to go to IIT despite being inside the cut-off for one reason or another (e.g., not having a high enough rank to get into their preferred line of study) who've gone on to have extremely good careers nonetheless. Although admittedly, I'm struggling to think of any IIT graduates who did not end up with a solid to brilliant career, regardless of their actual academic performance while at IIT. Some to my great surprise! So what I'm saying is... there's not enough data to make a statement like you did.
- th3iedkid 13y ago
  Given today's scenario the quality of engineers is dipping.So does the gap and thus even a decently meritorious engineer looks much better than the rest of the crowd.An old study http://careers.learnhub.com/news/544-90-percent-graduates-and-75-percent-engineers-are-unemployable-nasscom http://careers.learnhub.com/news/544-90-percent-graduates-an... shows how poor the rest of the colleges are.That said the socioeconomic gap keeps widening and thus opinions.Opinions are hard to break lest someone disprove.Vast majority of indian IT companies still run aptitude test to figure out who squares out a big number faster and cracks the tell-tale puzzle quicker rather who can understand the system and engineer better.So are their parent's prioties:education is BIG investment and they only want returns not knowledge.Well then these IT companies pay for a 12 hour code/test/typo job!And these companies are PRESTIGIOUS in india!!
  - chetanahuja 13y ago
    I'm finding it hard to decipher the point you're trying to make other than the fact that you're dissatisfied with... uhh... things in India. No argument there. I am too. The discussion at hand was about the small set of people who perhaps have the capability to get into IIT's but for various reasons don't manage to get in the top 2% in that particular test. I asserted that such people end up in other decent colleges (and there are plenty of good ones outside of the IIT system and they still form only a fraction of the sum total of Engineering education in India) and generally tend to end up in good to great careers. Any opinions on that discussion ?

rgovind 13y ago

You are right about smart people outside the 2%. IITs own study says that entrance exam marks vary by 1 or 2 for ranks between 2000 and 10000 The govt has recently opened 10+ new IITs. I think they should add many more..though.

NTDF 13y ago

As a person just outside the 2% (yes, I failed those entrance exams) and yet currently residing in Silicon Valley, I disagree. I would much rather preserve the sanctity of those few colleges. I'd rather have other universities collaborate/compete with the IITs. Not very different from how CMU is competing with IVY league universities here.