11 ms·

German City Set To Make Linux A Norm For Citizens

127 points by mariuz 13y ago

keithpeter 13y ago
"Lubuntu can comfortably run on as little as 256MB of RAM." It can although I'd call it jogging rather than running. It can work on a P3 coppermine class laptop very nicely. However, a stock Lubuntu live CD does not come with LibreOffice. Gnumeric is a nice spreadsheet, but Abiword normally does not have built in facilities for mathematical formulas, or for making drawings. There appears [1] to be no presentation application. I hope the City are making some training materials available along with advice on installing LibreOffice. LO will jog on a 900MHz p3/256Mb one application at a time. [1] https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Lubuntu/Setup#Applications https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Lubuntu/Setup#Applications Edit: I should say on P4 upwards or a Centrino laptop with 512Mb it will fly, and run LO fine with multiple applications.
- mtgx 13y ago
  I think at this point the apps themselves have a bigger impact than the OS. Websites can easily take 50-100 MB of RAM these days, each. Open a few of those, and you can already slow down your PC with low RAM. All of these "low-end" operating systems should have at least 1 GB of RAM as the bare minimum, and something with a more modern OS like Ubuntu or Windows 7 should use at least 2 GB of RAM, otherwise you have the same problem.
  - dllthomas 13y ago
    Eh, just run Lynx...
  - tsahyt 13y ago
    What sorts of websites are we talking about here? I understand that some websites have to transfer a couple of megabytes to be displayed (though most of that is media content anyway) but how does that end up occupying 100MB of RAM? That's roughly an order of magnitude more than I'd like a website to take, except for when we're talking streaming media obviously.
    - peterjmag 13y ago
      Looking at Chrome's Task Manager: my Gmail tab weighs in at 255 MB. Facebook is #2, at 168 MB. All that client-side JS gets pretty heavy. Interestingly, #3 is the home page of an old blogspot.com blog. It's mostly just text and a few inline images, and it still somehow manages to occupy 132 MB of RAM.
      - rotnewson 13y ago
        I'm guessing this is either because of chrome's sandboxed tabs or the amount of RAM you have on your computer (or a combination of both). Firefox is lighter on the RAM usage these days especially with more tabs because of the sandboxing.
    - com2kid 13y ago
      I use a web IM client, it can easily consume hundreds upon hundreds of megabytes if left open for a few days, and that is just to send small snippets of text back and forth! About:Memory in Firefox right now, with nothing other than this reply box open, shows JS using 67.29MB and well over 100MB of memory used for other purposes. (Likely this is left over from tabs I have closed)
      - PavlovsCat 13y ago
        About:Memory in Firefox right now, with nothing other than this reply box open, shows JS using 67.29MB and well over 100MB of memory used for other purposes. (Likely this is left over from tabs I have closed) I think it's just general overhead, since I have similar figures when starting FF fresh with no tabs. If you look at "window-objects" under explicit allocations, you can see the memory for individual pages; the page of your parent comment weighs 2.2 MB for me. But that's without history... when you click links, it will keep the previous pages cached, and I think that is what can really eat a lot of memory real quick. But I would also hope that memory gets released without much of a fuss? I don't know that, but if the RAM is made available when system resources get low, I'd say cache away, since unused RAM just eats electricity for nothing :P
    - mtgx 13y ago
- swah 13y ago
  Quite sincerely, I just tried switching to Ubuntu 13.04 (from Win7) on my gaming machine (4GB Ram, some Nvidia card that I can play BF3 very well), and it doesn't "Run" like Windows either. Chrome is slow to start, videos don't load properly, ejecting the pendrive fails...
  - NoodleIncident 13y ago
    Did you get the proprietary drivers for that Nvidia card? They can't legally be included in the distro itself, you have to go get them, which is a shame.
    - quaint- 13y ago
      The situation described by GP is so ridiculous that it's unlikely to be true, which is why I wouldn't recommend anyone to waste their time trying to solve the mentioned "problems". I mean, really, why would anyone switch from Windows to Ubuntu on a gaming machine? Just think about it for a sec. (Videos not loading or USB not working are issues the OEM are supposed to handle. The fact that someone like GP can't tell even the series of their GPU hints strongly toward them using a prebuilt computer - yet expecting to be able to work as their own Linux OEM, which one could argue is more difficult than being a Windows OEM.)
      - Discordian93 13y ago
        I installed ubuntu alongside windows on my alienware, and I'm quite happy with it, I only switch to windows to play dota 2 and amalur, for browsing, other games and miscellaneous tasks I use linux.
      - venomsnake 13y ago
        Well I did. So far I have close to 100 native games and I have been able to play a lot of recent games with playonlinux. So not bad at all. One of the few things missing is decent Everything clone for linux - something that reads directly from the journal and is able to find files instantly by names without useless indexing of the contents.
- yuhong 13y ago
  This reminds me that the i815 chipset is limited to 512MB RAM total, which was used in lots of P3 systems.
- D9u 13y ago
  Installing LibreOffice on Lubuntu is so easy that even a caveman (me) can do it. 1.) Open Synaptic Package Manager. 2.) Enter Admin Password. 3.) Type "LibreOffice" into the search field. 4.) Follow the on screen prompts, clicking appropriately. All of the various Lubuntu applications I've tried run quite well on my nearly 5 year old Atom N270(800MHz) 1GB RAM netbook. Seriously, if a user has rudimentary experience with WinXP then Lubuntu will not be too much to assimilate, and the only caveats are proprietary applications, yet there exists workarounds for most, such as comphoilio's netflix-desktop - which uses a special version of wine to run Silverlight and its necessary components - to enable viewing of Netflix DRM content on Debian based systems. http://www.compholio.com/netflix-desktop/ http://www.compholio.com/netflix-desktop/
  - keithpeter 13y ago
    Absolutely! But many of the target audience may have very little experience of installing software and may need a screen cam / leaflet along the lines of your instructions. Last time I tried Lubuntu, I had to manually install the appropriate spell checker for my language (en-gb). Many will want ms core fonts as well. I agree the whole thing is one side of A4 with a few scren shots. PS: Atom based netbooks with 1Gb are much more capable than P3/256Mb, people with such netbooks will have no issues at all with Lubuntu. I'm running ubuntustudio fine on this Samsung NC10.
- vanderZwan 13y ago
  "Abiword normally does not have built in facilities for mathematical formulas" The Xerox Alto had this in 1982[1]. NINETEEN FREAKING EIGHTY TWO. How is it possible that any WYSIWYG word processor is allowed to ship without this? [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ODZBL80JPqw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ODZBL80JPqw
  - girvo 13y ago
    Because AbiWords codebase is so painful, adding it is more trouble than it's worth. I tried to port it to elementary with a new UI. Dear god.
jtome 13y ago
Lubuntu is a fantastic choice, I install it on all of my friends' old, crapped up, virus infested Windows XP computers and it has them running like new. The interface requires almost no adjusting to coming from XP, much less so than unity or xfce or even windows 8 for that matter. Throwing away old but functioning hardware should be a crime.
- jdeibele 13y ago
  Yeah, except that the cost of power to run those machines can be significant. The most obvious difference would be reducing consumption by replacing a CRT monitor with an LCD. That should have minor effect on Ubuntu ... today ... maybe. But I do remember fighting to get a monitor configured a couple of years ago (before I moved to a Mac). Are modern desktops more efficient than 10 years ago? Hard for me to say although Intel has a paper that says that Energy Star and other measures make a big difference. Probably the easiest thing to do would be to swap the old desktop for a modern laptop. You'd gain all kinds of energy savings - LCD screen, automatic sleeping, etc.
lucb1e 13y ago
Incredible initiative! Where can I donate :)
stinos 13y ago
seems like a great idea, but knowing how older people can cope with change I don't see this going so easily and nicely for them as the article makes it sound? Anecdote: 2 of my family members over 50 years old had XP running with Office2003. I gave them Lubuntu and it took them literally months to adapt. For an IT guy it's off course all alike, but actually it isn't. Especially not if it already took you years to master Xp/Office in the first place. Apart from that, while I applaud them wanting to reuse old hardware, it seems most pc hardware lives for 10-15 years max. So I hope theay are prepared for that with appropriate backup systsems so they can recover all the systems that will eventually, sooner than later, shut down.
- hnha 13y ago
  counter anecdotes: my 73 year old grandma switched to Linux mint 9 months ago and loves it. and my 21 year old cousin tried the same and ran back to Windows after days.
  - mtgx 13y ago
    I'm not much of a Linux user (I only check out some distros once in a while), but I found Linux Mint Cinnamon to be extremely intuitive, and I "got it" right away. I actually thought it was easier to use than Windows 7, and I use Windows 7 all the time. I also think Zorin OS is looking great, and it seems like a very nice OS for those moving from Windows 7, especially. http://zorin-os.com/ http://zorin-os.com/
  - Everlag 13y ago
    The issue is, for a person as old as your grandmother, learning even the barebones of how to use a computer can be a novel experience because they have had a very small chunk of their entire life to attempt it. This is following having access to many other modern forms of entertainment for far longer. Whereas, in the case of the young cousin, they grew up with tech like this and having to relearn something that is basically the same system but with a different coat of paint and more inconveniences is a hassle.
- kryten 13y ago
  My olds have no idea what they are doing and have to relearn it every time it gets turned on anyway. From experience working with end users over the last 20 years this is normal whatever your age for non-technical users. Discoverability is more important than absolute consistency.
hiddenfeatures 13y ago
Wait... That's what I am paying my taxes for? That's where my money goes? I am NOT against Linux being more widely used. And I like the idea that the city uses Linux to save money & more efficient. But pushing citizens to use Linux is NOT government business
- keithpeter 13y ago
  "But pushing citizens to use Linux is NOT government business" Not sure where you are from, but in Europe/UK local governments do get involved in promoting what might be described as lifestyle choices. E.g. smoking cessation, getting more exercise, healthy eating, making recycled furniture available cheap to poor people by establishing and promoting 'social enterprises' as we call them in the uk. I see the free CDs as that really, just saying 'there is an alternative to chucking your old PC away, just try this and see if it is enough for you'. Not so much pushing linux from any political/anti-microsoft position, just saying you don't have to spend (more) money.
  - mathnode 13y ago
    Yes. Less waste, and in theory users will be given more secure and up to date software experience, which should provide safety and confidence for online shopping, for more tasty taxable purchases. +1 for environment +1 for Capitalism EDIT: last +1 for education, and employment. No need to get a new fancy computer to do your homework or write a CV.
    - keithpeter 13y ago
      Not to mention reduction in costs for local and national government if people can fill in forms online as opposed to paper or going to an office...
      - skaevola 13y ago
        But that would require the local government to allow forms to be submitted online. Which mine hasn't :(
sanbor 13y ago
I would suggest the Trisquel distro, which is completely free software (it's officially sponsored by the FSF) and IMHO the desktop is more user friendly than Lubuntu. http://trisquel.info/ http://trisquel.info/
- jtome 13y ago
  Some of the primary things people use computers for are watching flash videos and listening to mp3s and I would rather people use 99% Free software and 1% proprietary software than the other way around because someone zelously recommended to them a 100% Free Distro, which they found unusable and then switched back to windows. One of my worst experiences when starting out with Linux was installing Debian on a laptop, when I was without ethernet, because it didn't come with the proprietary wifi driver I needed, I don't wish to subject a non-technical person to that.
  - tehwalrus 13y ago
    tried this recently on a macbook air without an ethernet port - it's actually not even as simple as downloading the relevant .deb on a flash drive and moving it over, as the default .deb will, sometimes, insist on downloading the actual firmware blob from the manufacturer during the install process! I refuse to pay for a USB ethernet adapter which I will use once, so I'm sticking with virtual machines for now. I agree, normal humans simply don't put up with this stuff - in the end, even I didn't!
saturdaysaint 13y ago
There are some admirable intentions here, but most of the older people I know that this would theoretically serve best are infinitely better served by a light tablet. I want my grandma checking her e-mail and doing her reading in the most comfortable environment/seat in the house; I suspect this will lead to a lot greater usage/engagement. And portability means it's easier to ask for help.
- muuh-gnu 13y ago
  Tablets, like mobiles generally sufferer from planned obsolescence. They are not meant to be used and receive updates for years and years, like people used XP. I want my grandma to not have to relearn to yet another UI every two years. Canonical has commited to support the LTS releases for half a decade, which, while not coparable to XP, is for older folks still a better bet than anything the mobile world has to offer.
  - Samuel_Michon 13y ago
    > Tablets, like mobiles generally sufferer from planned obsolescence. > I want my grandma to not have to relearn to yet another UI every two years. Those two statements have little to do with each other. The current (and upcoming) version of iOS still works largely the same way as iPhone OS did 6 years a go. Modern mobile OSes are easier to learn than desktop OSes and are less encumbered by malware. For someone who has never used a desktop computer or the Internet, starting off with a good tablet instead of a personal computer is a better choice.
  - thaumasiotes 13y ago
    As I understand it, XP wasn't meant to do that either; the fact that it lasted so long was more of a series of mistakes on Microsoft's part in getting a replacement out the door. I'm happy to be corrected, though.
    - yuhong 13y ago
      Even if Vista wasn't delayed, XP would have received security update support for at least 10 years after release.
deleted 13y ago
[deleted]
jb17 13y ago
The title is misleading: the city wants to distribute around 2000 linux CDs at events -- that's hardly making it a norm.
e3pi 13y ago
Another counterexample of the Hun typecast as being regimented and dutifully obsequious, and further reinforcing evidence that Jerry is brilliant and formidable.
dfrey 13y ago
2013: Year of the Linux desktop

127 points by mariuz 13y ago

"Lubuntu can comfortably run on as little as 256MB of RAM." It can although I'd call it jogging rather than running. It can work on a P3 coppermine class laptop very nicely. However, a stock Lubuntu live CD does not come with LibreOffice. Gnumeric is a nice spreadsheet, but Abiword normally does not have built in facilities for mathematical formulas, or for making drawings. There appears [1] to be no presentation application. I hope the City are making some training materials available along with advice on installing LibreOffice. LO will jog on a 900MHz p3/256Mb one application at a time. [1] https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Lubuntu/Setup#Applications https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Lubuntu/Setup#Applications Edit: I should say on P4 upwards or a Centrino laptop with 512Mb it will fly, and run LO fine with multiple applications.

mtgx 13y ago
I think at this point the apps themselves have a bigger impact than the OS. Websites can easily take 50-100 MB of RAM these days, each. Open a few of those, and you can already slow down your PC with low RAM. All of these "low-end" operating systems should have at least 1 GB of RAM as the bare minimum, and something with a more modern OS like Ubuntu or Windows 7 should use at least 2 GB of RAM, otherwise you have the same problem.
- dllthomas 13y ago
  Eh, just run Lynx...
- tsahyt 13y ago
  What sorts of websites are we talking about here? I understand that some websites have to transfer a couple of megabytes to be displayed (though most of that is media content anyway) but how does that end up occupying 100MB of RAM? That's roughly an order of magnitude more than I'd like a website to take, except for when we're talking streaming media obviously.
  - peterjmag 13y ago
    Looking at Chrome's Task Manager: my Gmail tab weighs in at 255 MB. Facebook is #2, at 168 MB. All that client-side JS gets pretty heavy. Interestingly, #3 is the home page of an old blogspot.com blog. It's mostly just text and a few inline images, and it still somehow manages to occupy 132 MB of RAM.
    - rotnewson 13y ago
      I'm guessing this is either because of chrome's sandboxed tabs or the amount of RAM you have on your computer (or a combination of both). Firefox is lighter on the RAM usage these days especially with more tabs because of the sandboxing.
  - com2kid 13y ago
    I use a web IM client, it can easily consume hundreds upon hundreds of megabytes if left open for a few days, and that is just to send small snippets of text back and forth! About:Memory in Firefox right now, with nothing other than this reply box open, shows JS using 67.29MB and well over 100MB of memory used for other purposes. (Likely this is left over from tabs I have closed)
    - PavlovsCat 13y ago
      About:Memory in Firefox right now, with nothing other than this reply box open, shows JS using 67.29MB and well over 100MB of memory used for other purposes. (Likely this is left over from tabs I have closed) I think it's just general overhead, since I have similar figures when starting FF fresh with no tabs. If you look at "window-objects" under explicit allocations, you can see the memory for individual pages; the page of your parent comment weighs 2.2 MB for me. But that's without history... when you click links, it will keep the previous pages cached, and I think that is what can really eat a lot of memory real quick. But I would also hope that memory gets released without much of a fuss? I don't know that, but if the RAM is made available when system resources get low, I'd say cache away, since unused RAM just eats electricity for nothing :P
  - mtgx 13y ago
swah 13y ago
Quite sincerely, I just tried switching to Ubuntu 13.04 (from Win7) on my gaming machine (4GB Ram, some Nvidia card that I can play BF3 very well), and it doesn't "Run" like Windows either. Chrome is slow to start, videos don't load properly, ejecting the pendrive fails...
- NoodleIncident 13y ago
  Did you get the proprietary drivers for that Nvidia card? They can't legally be included in the distro itself, you have to go get them, which is a shame.
  - quaint- 13y ago
    The situation described by GP is so ridiculous that it's unlikely to be true, which is why I wouldn't recommend anyone to waste their time trying to solve the mentioned "problems". I mean, really, why would anyone switch from Windows to Ubuntu on a gaming machine? Just think about it for a sec. (Videos not loading or USB not working are issues the OEM are supposed to handle. The fact that someone like GP can't tell even the series of their GPU hints strongly toward them using a prebuilt computer - yet expecting to be able to work as their own Linux OEM, which one could argue is more difficult than being a Windows OEM.)
    - Discordian93 13y ago
      I installed ubuntu alongside windows on my alienware, and I'm quite happy with it, I only switch to windows to play dota 2 and amalur, for browsing, other games and miscellaneous tasks I use linux.
    - venomsnake 13y ago
      Well I did. So far I have close to 100 native games and I have been able to play a lot of recent games with playonlinux. So not bad at all. One of the few things missing is decent Everything clone for linux - something that reads directly from the journal and is able to find files instantly by names without useless indexing of the contents.
yuhong 13y ago
This reminds me that the i815 chipset is limited to 512MB RAM total, which was used in lots of P3 systems.
D9u 13y ago
Installing LibreOffice on Lubuntu is so easy that even a caveman (me) can do it. 1.) Open Synaptic Package Manager. 2.) Enter Admin Password. 3.) Type "LibreOffice" into the search field. 4.) Follow the on screen prompts, clicking appropriately. All of the various Lubuntu applications I've tried run quite well on my nearly 5 year old Atom N270(800MHz) 1GB RAM netbook. Seriously, if a user has rudimentary experience with WinXP then Lubuntu will not be too much to assimilate, and the only caveats are proprietary applications, yet there exists workarounds for most, such as comphoilio's netflix-desktop - which uses a special version of wine to run Silverlight and its necessary components - to enable viewing of Netflix DRM content on Debian based systems. http://www.compholio.com/netflix-desktop/ http://www.compholio.com/netflix-desktop/
- keithpeter 13y ago
  Absolutely! But many of the target audience may have very little experience of installing software and may need a screen cam / leaflet along the lines of your instructions. Last time I tried Lubuntu, I had to manually install the appropriate spell checker for my language (en-gb). Many will want ms core fonts as well. I agree the whole thing is one side of A4 with a few scren shots. PS: Atom based netbooks with 1Gb are much more capable than P3/256Mb, people with such netbooks will have no issues at all with Lubuntu. I'm running ubuntustudio fine on this Samsung NC10.
vanderZwan 13y ago
"Abiword normally does not have built in facilities for mathematical formulas" The Xerox Alto had this in 1982[1]. NINETEEN FREAKING EIGHTY TWO. How is it possible that any WYSIWYG word processor is allowed to ship without this? [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ODZBL80JPqw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ODZBL80JPqw
- girvo 13y ago
  Because AbiWords codebase is so painful, adding it is more trouble than it's worth. I tried to port it to elementary with a new UI. Dear god.

jtome 13y ago

Lubuntu is a fantastic choice, I install it on all of my friends' old, crapped up, virus infested Windows XP computers and it has them running like new. The interface requires almost no adjusting to coming from XP, much less so than unity or xfce or even windows 8 for that matter. Throwing away old but functioning hardware should be a crime.

jdeibele 13y ago
Yeah, except that the cost of power to run those machines can be significant. The most obvious difference would be reducing consumption by replacing a CRT monitor with an LCD. That should have minor effect on Ubuntu ... today ... maybe. But I do remember fighting to get a monitor configured a couple of years ago (before I moved to a Mac). Are modern desktops more efficient than 10 years ago? Hard for me to say although Intel has a paper that says that Energy Star and other measures make a big difference. Probably the easiest thing to do would be to swap the old desktop for a modern laptop. You'd gain all kinds of energy savings - LCD screen, automatic sleeping, etc.

lucb1e 13y ago

Incredible initiative! Where can I donate :)

stinos 13y ago

seems like a great idea, but knowing how older people can cope with change I don't see this going so easily and nicely for them as the article makes it sound? Anecdote: 2 of my family members over 50 years old had XP running with Office2003. I gave them Lubuntu and it took them literally months to adapt. For an IT guy it's off course all alike, but actually it isn't. Especially not if it already took you years to master Xp/Office in the first place. Apart from that, while I applaud them wanting to reuse old hardware, it seems most pc hardware lives for 10-15 years max. So I hope theay are prepared for that with appropriate backup systsems so they can recover all the systems that will eventually, sooner than later, shut down.

hnha 13y ago
counter anecdotes: my 73 year old grandma switched to Linux mint 9 months ago and loves it. and my 21 year old cousin tried the same and ran back to Windows after days.
- mtgx 13y ago
  I'm not much of a Linux user (I only check out some distros once in a while), but I found Linux Mint Cinnamon to be extremely intuitive, and I "got it" right away. I actually thought it was easier to use than Windows 7, and I use Windows 7 all the time. I also think Zorin OS is looking great, and it seems like a very nice OS for those moving from Windows 7, especially. http://zorin-os.com/ http://zorin-os.com/
- Everlag 13y ago
  The issue is, for a person as old as your grandmother, learning even the barebones of how to use a computer can be a novel experience because they have had a very small chunk of their entire life to attempt it. This is following having access to many other modern forms of entertainment for far longer. Whereas, in the case of the young cousin, they grew up with tech like this and having to relearn something that is basically the same system but with a different coat of paint and more inconveniences is a hassle.
kryten 13y ago
My olds have no idea what they are doing and have to relearn it every time it gets turned on anyway. From experience working with end users over the last 20 years this is normal whatever your age for non-technical users. Discoverability is more important than absolute consistency.

hiddenfeatures 13y ago

Wait... That's what I am paying my taxes for? That's where my money goes? I am NOT against Linux being more widely used. And I like the idea that the city uses Linux to save money & more efficient. But pushing citizens to use Linux is NOT government business

keithpeter 13y ago
"But pushing citizens to use Linux is NOT government business" Not sure where you are from, but in Europe/UK local governments do get involved in promoting what might be described as lifestyle choices. E.g. smoking cessation, getting more exercise, healthy eating, making recycled furniture available cheap to poor people by establishing and promoting 'social enterprises' as we call them in the uk. I see the free CDs as that really, just saying 'there is an alternative to chucking your old PC away, just try this and see if it is enough for you'. Not so much pushing linux from any political/anti-microsoft position, just saying you don't have to spend (more) money.
- mathnode 13y ago
  Yes. Less waste, and in theory users will be given more secure and up to date software experience, which should provide safety and confidence for online shopping, for more tasty taxable purchases. +1 for environment +1 for Capitalism EDIT: last +1 for education, and employment. No need to get a new fancy computer to do your homework or write a CV.
  - keithpeter 13y ago
    Not to mention reduction in costs for local and national government if people can fill in forms online as opposed to paper or going to an office...
    - skaevola 13y ago
      But that would require the local government to allow forms to be submitted online. Which mine hasn't :(

sanbor 13y ago

I would suggest the Trisquel distro, which is completely free software (it's officially sponsored by the FSF) and IMHO the desktop is more user friendly than Lubuntu. http://trisquel.info/ http://trisquel.info/

jtome 13y ago
Some of the primary things people use computers for are watching flash videos and listening to mp3s and I would rather people use 99% Free software and 1% proprietary software than the other way around because someone zelously recommended to them a 100% Free Distro, which they found unusable and then switched back to windows. One of my worst experiences when starting out with Linux was installing Debian on a laptop, when I was without ethernet, because it didn't come with the proprietary wifi driver I needed, I don't wish to subject a non-technical person to that.
- tehwalrus 13y ago
  tried this recently on a macbook air without an ethernet port - it's actually not even as simple as downloading the relevant .deb on a flash drive and moving it over, as the default .deb will, sometimes, insist on downloading the actual firmware blob from the manufacturer during the install process! I refuse to pay for a USB ethernet adapter which I will use once, so I'm sticking with virtual machines for now. I agree, normal humans simply don't put up with this stuff - in the end, even I didn't!

saturdaysaint 13y ago

There are some admirable intentions here, but most of the older people I know that this would theoretically serve best are infinitely better served by a light tablet. I want my grandma checking her e-mail and doing her reading in the most comfortable environment/seat in the house; I suspect this will lead to a lot greater usage/engagement. And portability means it's easier to ask for help.

muuh-gnu 13y ago
Tablets, like mobiles generally sufferer from planned obsolescence. They are not meant to be used and receive updates for years and years, like people used XP. I want my grandma to not have to relearn to yet another UI every two years. Canonical has commited to support the LTS releases for half a decade, which, while not coparable to XP, is for older folks still a better bet than anything the mobile world has to offer.
- Samuel_Michon 13y ago
  > Tablets, like mobiles generally sufferer from planned obsolescence. > I want my grandma to not have to relearn to yet another UI every two years. Those two statements have little to do with each other. The current (and upcoming) version of iOS still works largely the same way as iPhone OS did 6 years a go. Modern mobile OSes are easier to learn than desktop OSes and are less encumbered by malware. For someone who has never used a desktop computer or the Internet, starting off with a good tablet instead of a personal computer is a better choice.
- thaumasiotes 13y ago
  As I understand it, XP wasn't meant to do that either; the fact that it lasted so long was more of a series of mistakes on Microsoft's part in getting a replacement out the door. I'm happy to be corrected, though.
  - yuhong 13y ago
    Even if Vista wasn't delayed, XP would have received security update support for at least 10 years after release.

deleted 13y ago

[deleted]

jb17 13y ago

The title is misleading: the city wants to distribute around 2000 linux CDs at events -- that's hardly making it a norm.

e3pi 13y ago

Another counterexample of the Hun typecast as being regimented and dutifully obsequious, and further reinforcing evidence that Jerry is brilliant and formidable.

dfrey 13y ago

2013: Year of the Linux desktop