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> No one has found a way to put a dollar sign on this kind of literacy, and I doubt anyone ever will. But everyone who possesses it — no matter how or when it

> No one has found a way to put a dollar sign on this kind of literacy, and I doubt anyone ever will. But everyone who possesses it — no matter how or when it was acquired — knows that it is a rare and precious inheritance. This is a widespread sentiment. This is even a chic sentiment. This is maybe even a sentiment I once sympathized with. It is also the kind of romantic bullshit that hurts people. It doesn't really matter if Johnny Middle Class believes it, his parents can probably help him muddle along somehow. Jorge, though, first in his family to get to college, might just take it seriously, and wind up somewhere ugly with too much debt, four years gone, and a piece of paper that nobody wants. I personally know at least a dozen people like that. I didn't make that mistake- but it was more by whim than anything else. The worst, saddest part of all of this, is how trope heavy and unoriginal it is. This is the world's second oldest complaint, right after "the youth are lazy and disrespectful."

foobarbazqux 13y ago
Surely the oldest complaint is that life's too brutal for romance. But why bother living, without meaning, without romance?
- abraininavat 13y ago
  meaning == romance ??
  - foobarbazqux 13y ago
    That's a good question. If giving meaning to our experience is an act of creation, then perhaps this is romantic originality. But honestly, I didn't really think about it, I just thought "romantic" and that's what came out.
sk5t 13y ago
Are you arguing that there exists a class of people smart enough to gain admission into and pay for college, yet too simpleminded to assess the hazy job prospects based around a degree in English, psychology, art history, and the like? As far as I know, every major world culture produces writers, poets, sculptors, and musicians, and in no case is an education in those fields a guaranteed ticket to economic prosperity.
- ritchiea 13y ago
  You're assuming a lot here. A lot of intelligent people are told at a young age that college is an answer to their life aspirations. Just college. Not college and smart decisions about what to study and what habits to form and who to make friends with and what to do in the years in between. College. That's it. As a culture, we've told young people that. That's what I was told at least. I went to liberal arts school and studied psychology and I had no idea what would be necessary to get a job after graduation. In fact I assumed since I was in college and all these smart interesting adults around me seemed to think studying psychology or English was a normal decision that I wouldn't have to worry about practical things like finding a job afterwards because I was at a good college and after a good college those sort of things fall into place. Fortunately for me I am resourceful and patient with the idea that my education taught me to think and communicate well and that practical skills are things you can acquire on your own time and hard work. But a lot of teenagers are told college alone is an answer. And young people are naive. It is a problem with how we guide young people through their lives not a problem with them not understanding the world.
- scarmig 13y ago
  Yes. Simple-minded is an obnoxious word; brainwashed gets closer to it but implies too much a malevolent force at work. Cold statistics are one thing, but everyone has trouble actually chewing them over when every part of your environment is telling you "all you need to do is go to college, and everything will work out fine." If you know the ins and outs of how post-college employment works, you're working from a position of stark informational privilege compared to someone who doesn't. The people who succeed as English majors are much louder than the large majority who don't, and the people selling the English majors certainly aren't telling them they have a decent chance of ending up immiserated. If you genuinely enjoy English literature and writing, it's easy to fall into that trap. Many people here majored in CS, and that's awesome and has worked out well for them. But I would also take a gander that, going into college, those people weren't blank slates who had no love of CS and just did a mechanical calculation as to what would generate the most time-discounted income years. They had worked with computers in the past and loved it. It's very easy to overlook how much emotional or arational factors plays into your own choices while condemning those whose arational choices end up tossing them into another bin. Obviously the choices people make aren't totally ignorant of economic factors, but they also aren't determined by them.
gammarator 13y ago
The "it" in the passage you quote is not an English degree, but the skill to write well: "the ability to distribute [your] thinking in the kinds of sentences that have a merit, even a literary merit, of their own." The author is not saying everyone should major in English; she is saying that the skills of rhetoric--careful reading, clear writing, tight argumentation--are powerful and shouldn't be lost in the rush to "marketable" majors.
- krakensden 13y ago
  He[1] wrote a short piece decrying the decline of the English Major. That was the closing line. The klaxon call to action of the salesman would be gauche. [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Verlyn_Klinkenborg http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Verlyn_Klinkenborg
Crake 13y ago
"Jorge, though, first in his family to get to college, might just take it seriously, and wind up somewhere ugly with too much debt, four years gone, and a piece of paper that nobody wants." This exactly. This sort of lie about college--that it doesn't matter what the cost is--is perpetuated by meaningless and empty platitudes. Unlike many others of the kind, however, it has the potential to permanently destroy a young person's life. High school guidance counselors whose parents paid for their education still continue to advise kids without any parental support that they should spend as much money as possible to get the "best" education they can afford. It's cruelty of the highest form: apathy towards those from lesser circumstances than you.

foobarbazqux 13y ago

Surely the oldest complaint is that life's too brutal for romance. But why bother living, without meaning, without romance?

abraininavat 13y ago
meaning == romance ??
- foobarbazqux 13y ago
  That's a good question. If giving meaning to our experience is an act of creation, then perhaps this is romantic originality. But honestly, I didn't really think about it, I just thought "romantic" and that's what came out.

sk5t 13y ago

Are you arguing that there exists a class of people smart enough to gain admission into and pay for college, yet too simpleminded to assess the hazy job prospects based around a degree in English, psychology, art history, and the like? As far as I know, every major world culture produces writers, poets, sculptors, and musicians, and in no case is an education in those fields a guaranteed ticket to economic prosperity.

ritchiea 13y ago
You're assuming a lot here. A lot of intelligent people are told at a young age that college is an answer to their life aspirations. Just college. Not college and smart decisions about what to study and what habits to form and who to make friends with and what to do in the years in between. College. That's it. As a culture, we've told young people that. That's what I was told at least. I went to liberal arts school and studied psychology and I had no idea what would be necessary to get a job after graduation. In fact I assumed since I was in college and all these smart interesting adults around me seemed to think studying psychology or English was a normal decision that I wouldn't have to worry about practical things like finding a job afterwards because I was at a good college and after a good college those sort of things fall into place. Fortunately for me I am resourceful and patient with the idea that my education taught me to think and communicate well and that practical skills are things you can acquire on your own time and hard work. But a lot of teenagers are told college alone is an answer. And young people are naive. It is a problem with how we guide young people through their lives not a problem with them not understanding the world.
scarmig 13y ago
Yes. Simple-minded is an obnoxious word; brainwashed gets closer to it but implies too much a malevolent force at work. Cold statistics are one thing, but everyone has trouble actually chewing them over when every part of your environment is telling you "all you need to do is go to college, and everything will work out fine." If you know the ins and outs of how post-college employment works, you're working from a position of stark informational privilege compared to someone who doesn't. The people who succeed as English majors are much louder than the large majority who don't, and the people selling the English majors certainly aren't telling them they have a decent chance of ending up immiserated. If you genuinely enjoy English literature and writing, it's easy to fall into that trap. Many people here majored in CS, and that's awesome and has worked out well for them. But I would also take a gander that, going into college, those people weren't blank slates who had no love of CS and just did a mechanical calculation as to what would generate the most time-discounted income years. They had worked with computers in the past and loved it. It's very easy to overlook how much emotional or arational factors plays into your own choices while condemning those whose arational choices end up tossing them into another bin. Obviously the choices people make aren't totally ignorant of economic factors, but they also aren't determined by them.

gammarator 13y ago

The "it" in the passage you quote is not an English degree, but the skill to write well: "the ability to distribute [your] thinking in the kinds of sentences that have a merit, even a literary merit, of their own." The author is not saying everyone should major in English; she is saying that the skills of rhetoric--careful reading, clear writing, tight argumentation--are powerful and shouldn't be lost in the rush to "marketable" majors.

krakensden 13y ago
He[1] wrote a short piece decrying the decline of the English Major. That was the closing line. The klaxon call to action of the salesman would be gauche. [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Verlyn_Klinkenborg http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Verlyn_Klinkenborg

Crake 13y ago

"Jorge, though, first in his family to get to college, might just take it seriously, and wind up somewhere ugly with too much debt, four years gone, and a piece of paper that nobody wants." This exactly. This sort of lie about college--that it doesn't matter what the cost is--is perpetuated by meaningless and empty platitudes. Unlike many others of the kind, however, it has the potential to permanently destroy a young person's life. High school guidance counselors whose parents paid for their education still continue to advise kids without any parental support that they should spend as much money as possible to get the "best" education they can afford. It's cruelty of the highest form: apathy towards those from lesser circumstances than you.