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As an American who eats out a lot, I have to admit I loved going to Iceland where tipping is not expected whatsoever. Tipping feels like prostitution; when cas

As an American who eats out a lot, I have to admit I loved going to Iceland where tipping is not expected whatsoever. Tipping feels like prostitution; when cash is exchanged it's hard to believe you're getting authentic service.

csense 13y ago
> when cash is exchanged it's hard to believe you're getting authentic service This doesn't even make sense. Are you a Communist or something?
- geon 13y ago
  I think that was just a poorly worded statement. See the comment by aaron695.
dragonwriter 13y ago
Money is being exchanged for service whether its bundled into the price charged for food and drink, tacked on as an explicit service fee, or paid separately as a tip. If paying for service feels equivalent to prostitution to you, well, if you want to avoid "prostitution", you're going to need to forgo a lot of common economic activity.
- toastedzergling 13y ago
  I didn't express myself well enough, but your comment helped coax the idea from my heart to my brain: I have no problems with explicit fees, nothing about that feels wrong to me. They are black and white. I want food, I pay for it. The non-negotiable, you pay the price on the menu aspect means both parties know fully-well in advance and can agree to what's being exchanged. It's the ambiguous / "implicit" fees that cause me anguish. The waitress, in knowing that after the meal I'll be forced to make a judgment call, evaluating their service allows the possibility that every interaction leading up until I've paid them has been constructed to manipulate me. And outside an egregious there's little I can do to prove/disprove that. Whereas if its spelled out that upon entering the restaurant you will "pay XX rate for the service to do YY for you" you have the peace of mind that all parties involved know exactly what's going on. And anything they do above and beyond that is authentically who they are. If they tell me a joke, I know it's because they wanted to, not because they thought it might coax more money out of me.
smsm42 13y ago
Wait, what? You mean service from my car mechanic, gardener, pool guy, garbage collector, repairman, contractor, hairdresser, sports trainer, etc. - all "unauthentic" because I pay money for it? Or it is only when serving food that paying for it somehow becomes "unauthentic"? It is extremely weird notion that paying for service is somehow not expected. Why do you think all these people do it - out of deep and passionate love for you?
- aaron695 13y ago
  A gardener cuts my lawn for money they are not payed to be nice. If they are nice then I assume it's because they are nice, not because they are doing it for money, since there's no direct obvious correlation. (Especially if they don't own the business.) Prostitutes are payed to be nice, that is their service so the nice bit is "unauthentic". Just as the gardener might not be cutting my lawn for love, it's probably just money, but the friendly conversation probably is real. Once you start tipping the niceness is much more out there as possibly faked. Simple statement to me.
  - smsm42 13y ago
    There is an obvious correlation - if I employ someone and he's not nice to me, I'll fire him (or stop ordering his services) and hire somebody who is. Why should I suffer for my own money? Of course, there could be cases where I have no choice - like when I'm dealing with some sort of government monopoly like telecom or water company - but even there people are usually nice and there are ways to deal with it if they are not. >>> Once you start tipping the niceness is much more out there as possibly faked. What you mean by "faked"? I don't want each of these people to become by best friends forever or have deep emotional relationship with me. I don't date them or plan to spend a romantic vacation with them. I want them to be polite, courteous and helpful. How can it be "fake"? How you distinguish "fake" please from "sincere" please and what that even means?
    - geon 13y ago
      You can be perfectly polite, corteous and helpful without being nice. That's just being proffessional. Being nice is to stand around after the job for a chat.

csense 13y ago

> when cash is exchanged it's hard to believe you're getting authentic service This doesn't even make sense. Are you a Communist or something?

geon 13y ago
I think that was just a poorly worded statement. See the comment by aaron695.

dragonwriter 13y ago

Money is being exchanged for service whether its bundled into the price charged for food and drink, tacked on as an explicit service fee, or paid separately as a tip. If paying for service feels equivalent to prostitution to you, well, if you want to avoid "prostitution", you're going to need to forgo a lot of common economic activity.

toastedzergling 13y ago
I didn't express myself well enough, but your comment helped coax the idea from my heart to my brain: I have no problems with explicit fees, nothing about that feels wrong to me. They are black and white. I want food, I pay for it. The non-negotiable, you pay the price on the menu aspect means both parties know fully-well in advance and can agree to what's being exchanged. It's the ambiguous / "implicit" fees that cause me anguish. The waitress, in knowing that after the meal I'll be forced to make a judgment call, evaluating their service allows the possibility that every interaction leading up until I've paid them has been constructed to manipulate me. And outside an egregious there's little I can do to prove/disprove that. Whereas if its spelled out that upon entering the restaurant you will "pay XX rate for the service to do YY for you" you have the peace of mind that all parties involved know exactly what's going on. And anything they do above and beyond that is authentically who they are. If they tell me a joke, I know it's because they wanted to, not because they thought it might coax more money out of me.

smsm42 13y ago

Wait, what? You mean service from my car mechanic, gardener, pool guy, garbage collector, repairman, contractor, hairdresser, sports trainer, etc. - all "unauthentic" because I pay money for it? Or it is only when serving food that paying for it somehow becomes "unauthentic"? It is extremely weird notion that paying for service is somehow not expected. Why do you think all these people do it - out of deep and passionate love for you?

aaron695 13y ago
A gardener cuts my lawn for money they are not payed to be nice. If they are nice then I assume it's because they are nice, not because they are doing it for money, since there's no direct obvious correlation. (Especially if they don't own the business.) Prostitutes are payed to be nice, that is their service so the nice bit is "unauthentic". Just as the gardener might not be cutting my lawn for love, it's probably just money, but the friendly conversation probably is real. Once you start tipping the niceness is much more out there as possibly faked. Simple statement to me.
- smsm42 13y ago
  There is an obvious correlation - if I employ someone and he's not nice to me, I'll fire him (or stop ordering his services) and hire somebody who is. Why should I suffer for my own money? Of course, there could be cases where I have no choice - like when I'm dealing with some sort of government monopoly like telecom or water company - but even there people are usually nice and there are ways to deal with it if they are not. >>> Once you start tipping the niceness is much more out there as possibly faked. What you mean by "faked"? I don't want each of these people to become by best friends forever or have deep emotional relationship with me. I don't date them or plan to spend a romantic vacation with them. I want them to be polite, courteous and helpful. How can it be "fake"? How you distinguish "fake" please from "sincere" please and what that even means?
  - geon 13y ago
    You can be perfectly polite, corteous and helpful without being nice. That's just being proffessional. Being nice is to stand around after the job for a chat.