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In the past Snowden has leaked to journalists, but what happens in the following scenario? Russia: "Snowden, the U.S. has requested that we detain you. We cou

by codex 13y ago

In the past Snowden has leaked to journalists, but what happens in the following scenario? Russia: "Snowden, the U.S. has requested that we detain you. We could hand your over to the U.S., but we'd be happy to offer you political asylyum here, or we could let you leave for Ecuador in a few hours and tell the U.S. we couldn't find you in time." Snowden: "I'd like to leave for Ecuador, please." Russia: "Well, then, all you have to do is tell us everything you know about programs X, Y, and Z. We're very interested in these programs, and anything you can tell us about U.S. surveillance of Russian government and military activities." Snowden: "I don't know anything about those." Russia: "Well, OK, I guess it's prison for you then." Snowden: "No, wait--I'll tell you everything I know." And boom: intelligence jackpot for Russia.

montecarl 13y ago
I think that most of what he has said so far has been corroborated. He has done enough to raise awareness of the issues that we know to be true. He should do whatever he needs to remain safe.
doe88 13y ago
Or instead of pushing him to do whatever it takes to protect his own life which ultimately is a human reflex, the US Gov could have said: ok we acknowledge there is a problem with the data we gather, with the policies we enacted and with the way we informed the people, come back home we won't charge you for espionnage and we will listen to you to improve how we could protect the US without compromising privacy.
- twoodfin 13y ago
  When did we decide that the national security programs of the United States should give a damn what a random 30 year old contractor thinks about them? This is risible. Who voted for Edward Snowden? What he has done is not confined to "whistleblowing", if indeed any of it is. He apparently stole massive amounts of classified information, much of it on programs that by any reasonable definition are legitimate, albeit potentially embarrassing. He's now flying around from one U.S. strategic competitor to another, apparently unconcerned that what he stole could end up in the hands of those who do not wish the U.S. well. Feel free to describe him as being a hero to the world or whatever, but his protestations to have done all of this for love of country are starting to ring quite hollow.
  - kinghajj 13y ago
    He loves his country, but not his government. Big difference.
    - twoodfin 13y ago
      Out of curiosity, is there any classified information he could have turned over (intentionally or otherwise) to the Russians that would make you reconsider the wisdom of his decisions? What if one of those laptops has the names of undercover agents on it? I'm not saying it does, I'm just trying to understand the scope of your argument.
      - kinghajj 13y ago
        This sums up my position. http://www.reddit.com/r/technology/comments/1gvd45/z/caobk8t http://www.reddit.com/r/technology/comments/1gvd45/z/caobk8t
        twoodfin 13y ago
        Well, OK, then. Snowden is rightfully a hero to your ideology. But I think anyone who's read history can argue that the institutions that currently "run the world" are among the most beneficial to mankind ever to emerge. They're not perfect, but we should think twice before tearing them down.
        kinghajj 13y ago
        Oh absolutely they are the best so far, but they still aren't nearly good enough that we should just accept them and wait for their downfall or transition to come "naturally;" we must takes steps to ensure that the change occurs, not just wish it so.
  - rosser 13y ago
    ...but his protestations to have done all of this for love of country are starting to ring quite hollow. Why, because he doesn't behave in a way that comports with your definitions of love of country? IMO, the truest patriot is one who cares enough about his country to call out its faults. That he doesn't want to be "Gitmo-ed" or suffer "extraordinary rendition" to a place where they "interrogate" you by shoving a broken beer bottle up your ass is pretty orthogonal to patriotism, if you ask me.
- chourobin 13y ago
  This would be a terrible move for the US as it sets the example that leaking classified information is okay. Whether you believe what he did was right or wrong, he needs to face the consequences of his actions.

by codex 13y ago

montecarl 13y ago

I think that most of what he has said so far has been corroborated. He has done enough to raise awareness of the issues that we know to be true. He should do whatever he needs to remain safe.

doe88 13y ago

Or instead of pushing him to do whatever it takes to protect his own life which ultimately is a human reflex, the US Gov could have said: ok we acknowledge there is a problem with the data we gather, with the policies we enacted and with the way we informed the people, come back home we won't charge you for espionnage and we will listen to you to improve how we could protect the US without compromising privacy.

twoodfin 13y ago
When did we decide that the national security programs of the United States should give a damn what a random 30 year old contractor thinks about them? This is risible. Who voted for Edward Snowden? What he has done is not confined to "whistleblowing", if indeed any of it is. He apparently stole massive amounts of classified information, much of it on programs that by any reasonable definition are legitimate, albeit potentially embarrassing. He's now flying around from one U.S. strategic competitor to another, apparently unconcerned that what he stole could end up in the hands of those who do not wish the U.S. well. Feel free to describe him as being a hero to the world or whatever, but his protestations to have done all of this for love of country are starting to ring quite hollow.
- kinghajj 13y ago
  He loves his country, but not his government. Big difference.
  - twoodfin 13y ago
    Out of curiosity, is there any classified information he could have turned over (intentionally or otherwise) to the Russians that would make you reconsider the wisdom of his decisions? What if one of those laptops has the names of undercover agents on it? I'm not saying it does, I'm just trying to understand the scope of your argument.
    - kinghajj 13y ago
      This sums up my position. http://www.reddit.com/r/technology/comments/1gvd45/z/caobk8t http://www.reddit.com/r/technology/comments/1gvd45/z/caobk8t
      - twoodfin 13y ago
        Well, OK, then. Snowden is rightfully a hero to your ideology. But I think anyone who's read history can argue that the institutions that currently "run the world" are among the most beneficial to mankind ever to emerge. They're not perfect, but we should think twice before tearing them down.
        kinghajj 13y ago
        Oh absolutely they are the best so far, but they still aren't nearly good enough that we should just accept them and wait for their downfall or transition to come "naturally;" we must takes steps to ensure that the change occurs, not just wish it so.
- rosser 13y ago
  ...but his protestations to have done all of this for love of country are starting to ring quite hollow. Why, because he doesn't behave in a way that comports with your definitions of love of country? IMO, the truest patriot is one who cares enough about his country to call out its faults. That he doesn't want to be "Gitmo-ed" or suffer "extraordinary rendition" to a place where they "interrogate" you by shoving a broken beer bottle up your ass is pretty orthogonal to patriotism, if you ask me.
chourobin 13y ago
This would be a terrible move for the US as it sets the example that leaking classified information is okay. Whether you believe what he did was right or wrong, he needs to face the consequences of his actions.