5 ms·

Yes. That's what actual car accidents are like. The movies don't prepare you for that.

by groby_b 13y ago

ferdo 13y ago
"Cars just dont explode" http://automotivethinker.com/general/cars-just-dont-explode/ http://automotivethinker.com/general/cars-just-dont-explode/
- mbreese 13y ago
  But a collision with an object could sound like a bomb and have enough energy to cause an engine to fly 50+ yards.
  - kintamanimatt 13y ago
    And if he fell asleep (he was driving at night) and mistook the accelerator for the brake, it's quite likely the impact could have been quite a high energy one, especially in a car that's well powered.
  - ferdo 13y ago
    Hastings ticked off some very powerful people in his short life. Ticking powerful people off is a good way to die in a plane wreck, a car wreck, a "fall" or any number of other accidents. I'm not saying this is what happened, but it seems more likely than not that he was assassinated for his work.
    - snowwrestler 13y ago
      You know who else ticked off some powerful people? Daniel Ellsburg. Seymour Hersh. Bob Woodward. Julian Assange. Bradley Manning. All of whom are still alive. Hastings wrote a magazine story that forced a general to retire. That general is now making a very cozy living as a speaker and consultant. Not exactly horrible stuff. I just object to the mindset that ticking off powerful people is likely to lead to murder, when there is so much obvious counter evidence.
      - ferdo 13y ago
        Just like the guy that discovered Bush Jr's coke bust "committed suicide": http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Hatfield http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Hatfield This wasn't just a hit, it was personal. Someone really disliked Hastings.
        krapp 13y ago
        You can go into a bookstore right now and find books calling Obama a muslim traitor and probably the antichrist. If the government actually killed authors who wrote negative things about presidents during their terms, it would be the second leading cause of death for American authors after alcoholism. Hating on presidents in the long form is practically an entire genre. Sometimes, you know, people take too many pills and then they never wake up. Sometimes people get into car crashes. Sometimes things just happen, and death like life doesn't have to follow a neat and obvious narrative.
        lobster_johnson 13y ago
        > You can go into a bookstore right now and find books calling Obama a muslim traitor and probably the antichrist. But those things are untrue. There is no point in trying to silence — or to avenge the publication of — something that is (1) untrue and (2) does no measurable harm.
        krapp 13y ago
        Sure, but the administration already dealt with the book in the 'proper' way, which was to deny all allegations and discredit the author. I remember there being some jokes about it on late night television, but nothing major in terms of public relations fallout. I just don't see it as having been worth killing over, it was a minor though momentarily noteworthy event. I definitely don't see it as corroborating evidence that presidents so routinely have their opponents and critics killed that Michael Hastings' car crash must most likely have been a bomb (or whatever), when the more reasonable explanation seems to serve perfectly well.
        13y ago
    - JshWright 13y ago
      Wait... more likely than not? People die in crashes every day... fiery wrecks happen all the time... Parts fly out of vehicles in high impact collisions... None of these things are uncommon, so how do you possibly make the leap that it's 'more likely than not'?
      - ferdo 13y ago
        > how do you possibly make the leap that it's 'more likely than not'? Because I'm not a coincidence theorist when it comes to how power operates. The Obama administration has publicly claimed the power to kill American citizens, the first administration to do so. To ignore that consideration is just as shortsighted as saying, "A DRONE STRIKE DUN IT!".
        krapp 13y ago
        That still doesn't make it more likely than not. A regular car crash is still far more likely.
mindcrime 13y ago
>> One woman in the area described it sounding “like a bomb went off in the middle of the night” & a man said “I couldn’t >> have written a scene like this in a move” with the engine flying 50-60 yards from the car. > Yes. That's what actual car accidents are like. The movies don't prepare you for that. Eh... I don't know about that. For what it's worth, I was a firefighter for about a decade in the 90's and I personally responded to hundreds of car wrecks over that time. In my experience, engines do not leave the rest of the vehicle, fires are uncommon and explosions are essentially unheard of. Cars really do not just burst into flames with the slightest provocation, like in movies. If anything, movies dramatically overstate the fiery / explosive aspect of most car wrecks.
- JshWright 13y ago
  As a counter anecdote, I've seen that happen several times. A few months back, a truck struck a tree, the engine block was 50' away, and the transmission actually busted through a wall almost 70' away. Post-crash fires are certainly not common, but I'm sure you'll agree they do happen. I don't see any indication that there was an explosion (other than your typical bangs and pops as various gas cylinders detonate), and I wouldn't read too much into the quote about it sounding like a bomb. The initial impact could certainly have been loud enough to sound 'like a bomb'
  - mindcrime 13y ago
    As a counter anecdote, I've seen that happen several times. A few months back, a truck struck a tree, the engine block was 50' away, and the transmission actually busted through a wall almost 70' away. Interesting. I wonder what would account for the difference in experience? Maybe newer cars are more prone to that? Maybe traffic in your area is moving faster... are the accidents where you've seen this typically on a freeway / interstate, or a secondary road or what? The initial impact could certainly have been loud enough to sound 'like a bomb' Agreed, and that would be my default assumption, lacking any other evidence.
    - JshWright 13y ago

Yes. That's what actual car accidents are like. The movies don't prepare you for that.

by groby_b 13y ago

Yes. That's what actual car accidents are like. The movies don't prepare you for that.

ferdo 13y ago

"Cars just dont explode" http://automotivethinker.com/general/cars-just-dont-explode/ http://automotivethinker.com/general/cars-just-dont-explode/

mbreese 13y ago
But a collision with an object could sound like a bomb and have enough energy to cause an engine to fly 50+ yards.
- kintamanimatt 13y ago
  And if he fell asleep (he was driving at night) and mistook the accelerator for the brake, it's quite likely the impact could have been quite a high energy one, especially in a car that's well powered.
- ferdo 13y ago
  Hastings ticked off some very powerful people in his short life. Ticking powerful people off is a good way to die in a plane wreck, a car wreck, a "fall" or any number of other accidents. I'm not saying this is what happened, but it seems more likely than not that he was assassinated for his work.
  - snowwrestler 13y ago
    You know who else ticked off some powerful people? Daniel Ellsburg. Seymour Hersh. Bob Woodward. Julian Assange. Bradley Manning. All of whom are still alive. Hastings wrote a magazine story that forced a general to retire. That general is now making a very cozy living as a speaker and consultant. Not exactly horrible stuff. I just object to the mindset that ticking off powerful people is likely to lead to murder, when there is so much obvious counter evidence.
    - ferdo 13y ago
      Just like the guy that discovered Bush Jr's coke bust "committed suicide": http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Hatfield http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Hatfield This wasn't just a hit, it was personal. Someone really disliked Hastings.
      - krapp 13y ago
        You can go into a bookstore right now and find books calling Obama a muslim traitor and probably the antichrist. If the government actually killed authors who wrote negative things about presidents during their terms, it would be the second leading cause of death for American authors after alcoholism. Hating on presidents in the long form is practically an entire genre. Sometimes, you know, people take too many pills and then they never wake up. Sometimes people get into car crashes. Sometimes things just happen, and death like life doesn't have to follow a neat and obvious narrative.
        lobster_johnson 13y ago
        > You can go into a bookstore right now and find books calling Obama a muslim traitor and probably the antichrist. But those things are untrue. There is no point in trying to silence — or to avenge the publication of — something that is (1) untrue and (2) does no measurable harm.
        krapp 13y ago
        Sure, but the administration already dealt with the book in the 'proper' way, which was to deny all allegations and discredit the author. I remember there being some jokes about it on late night television, but nothing major in terms of public relations fallout. I just don't see it as having been worth killing over, it was a minor though momentarily noteworthy event. I definitely don't see it as corroborating evidence that presidents so routinely have their opponents and critics killed that Michael Hastings' car crash must most likely have been a bomb (or whatever), when the more reasonable explanation seems to serve perfectly well.
      - 13y ago
  - JshWright 13y ago
    Wait... more likely than not? People die in crashes every day... fiery wrecks happen all the time... Parts fly out of vehicles in high impact collisions... None of these things are uncommon, so how do you possibly make the leap that it's 'more likely than not'?
    - ferdo 13y ago
      > how do you possibly make the leap that it's 'more likely than not'? Because I'm not a coincidence theorist when it comes to how power operates. The Obama administration has publicly claimed the power to kill American citizens, the first administration to do so. To ignore that consideration is just as shortsighted as saying, "A DRONE STRIKE DUN IT!".
      - krapp 13y ago
        That still doesn't make it more likely than not. A regular car crash is still far more likely.

mindcrime 13y ago

>> One woman in the area described it sounding “like a bomb went off in the middle of the night” & a man said “I couldn’t >> have written a scene like this in a move” with the engine flying 50-60 yards from the car. > Yes. That's what actual car accidents are like. The movies don't prepare you for that. Eh... I don't know about that. For what it's worth, I was a firefighter for about a decade in the 90's and I personally responded to hundreds of car wrecks over that time. In my experience, engines do not leave the rest of the vehicle, fires are uncommon and explosions are essentially unheard of. Cars really do not just burst into flames with the slightest provocation, like in movies. If anything, movies dramatically overstate the fiery / explosive aspect of most car wrecks.

JshWright 13y ago
As a counter anecdote, I've seen that happen several times. A few months back, a truck struck a tree, the engine block was 50' away, and the transmission actually busted through a wall almost 70' away. Post-crash fires are certainly not common, but I'm sure you'll agree they do happen. I don't see any indication that there was an explosion (other than your typical bangs and pops as various gas cylinders detonate), and I wouldn't read too much into the quote about it sounding like a bomb. The initial impact could certainly have been loud enough to sound 'like a bomb'
- mindcrime 13y ago
  As a counter anecdote, I've seen that happen several times. A few months back, a truck struck a tree, the engine block was 50' away, and the transmission actually busted through a wall almost 70' away. Interesting. I wonder what would account for the difference in experience? Maybe newer cars are more prone to that? Maybe traffic in your area is moving faster... are the accidents where you've seen this typically on a freeway / interstate, or a secondary road or what? The initial impact could certainly have been loud enough to sound 'like a bomb' Agreed, and that would be my default assumption, lacking any other evidence.
  - JshWright 13y ago