5 ms·

Mozilla launches massive campaign on digital surveillance

103 points by sethbannon 13y ago

anon1385 13y ago
Mozilla need to take responsibility for their part in the construction of a world that allows such easy mass surveillance. The 'Open Web' puts a heavy emphasis on centralisation of user information.
- zimbatm 13y ago
  In what way the publication of HTML specifications and their implementation puts an emphasis on centralising data ? It does facilitate the transmission of data but it could be to your personal server over HTTPS.
  - betterunix 13y ago
    HTML5 is all about centralizing computation. It is pretty pointless to host a web app for one person's use; you can avoid many headaches and a lot of latency by running software locally. The only advantage network access has in that scenario is synchronizing data across multiple devices, but you do not need all the fancy HTML5 features or fast Javascript to do that; you just need a file sharing protocol.
    - sp332 13y ago
      It is not pointless to run a web app for one person's use. You could probably find a bunch of people here who do just that (I'm one of them). Standardization means that it's easy to move your data to any web service you like, and you can move your web app to any hosting provider you like. Even your own bedroom.
- sp332 13y ago
  The open web is supposed to prevent user lock-in and make it easy to choose where you put your data.
  - anonyfuss 13y ago
    You can choose to put your data anywhere you want, as long as it's in the cloud, in plaintext and readable to the vendor.
  - betterunix 13y ago
    In practice, it fails miserably at that.
- shardling 13y ago
  Heh, and a closed web would be better? This is kind of a borderline troll -- a nonsensical, sweeping generalization that will provoke a strong response. Let's not have this comment thread grow too deep. :)
elchief 13y ago
Mozilla just gave me a reason to consider buying their phone.
Steuard 13y ago
> This dragnet surveillance violates the First and Fourth Amendments of the U.S. Constitution, which protect citizens' right to speak and associate anonymously and guard against unreasonable searches and seizures that protect their right to privacy. The use of "protect" near the end of this sentence confuses me. Do they mean "violate"? Am I wrong to parse the final "that" as referring to the unreasonable searches? Is there any chance of clarifying this language given that this has already been made public?
- sp332 13y ago
  I think "that" is supposed to refer all the way back to "right" but it's very awkward.
betterunix 13y ago
So, will Mozilla be making ABP, Tor, GPG (for web forms), etc. standard features? Mozilla is actually in a position to help protect people from these sorts of intrusions. Are they willing to actually do something that might hurt their advertising industry friends in the name of protecting civil rights?
- sp332 13y ago
  At least they show ABP as the "most popular" add-on, and promote "Do Not Track Me" as a featured extension at https://addons.mozilla.org/ https://addons.mozilla.org/ Making Tor standard is never going to happen. It requires a lot of modifications to the browser https://www.torproject.org/projects/torbrowser/design/#Implementation https://www.torproject.org/projects/torbrowser/design/#Imple... and it's awkward to use https://www.torproject.org/download/download-easy.html.en#warning https://www.torproject.org/download/download-easy.html.en#wa...
  - malandrew 13y ago
    Making Tor standard is never going to happen. It requires a lot of modifications to the browser That may be true for Gecko, but I don't see it as unreasonable to start baking security into Servo, since it is a few years from being production ready and is being built from scratch.
- anonymfus 13y ago
  They always can just add banner asking for donations on top of the browser window like Wikipedia did.
mrschwabe 13y ago
This is great. But what would be more impressive is if Mozilla would drop Google as Firefox's primary search engine - and instead use a non-PRISM provider such as DuckDuckGo.
- jmilkbal 13y ago
  Google integration, by definition, defies Mozilla's mission. I'm okay with the integration knowing that I can fix it, though I wish there were a start-up option for novices or to have it outright removed, though.
  - mrschwabe 13y ago
    Exactly. At least if Mozilla would take some action to address the giant Google/NSA search box on the startup page of their browser - it would show us they are doing more than just hand-waiving about these recent revelations.
  - rz2k 13y ago
    Would many novices actually care. The commentary floating around the web by people without any background in data analysis or technology seems to be that the indignity of TSA searches matters more than the actual danger of enabling future people to appoint themselves power brokers in the model of J Edgar Hoover. If novices don't care, wouldn't it just be an additional hassle?

103 points by sethbannon 13y ago

Mozilla need to take responsibility for their part in the construction of a world that allows such easy mass surveillance. The 'Open Web' puts a heavy emphasis on centralisation of user information.

zimbatm 13y ago
In what way the publication of HTML specifications and their implementation puts an emphasis on centralising data ? It does facilitate the transmission of data but it could be to your personal server over HTTPS.
- betterunix 13y ago
  HTML5 is all about centralizing computation. It is pretty pointless to host a web app for one person's use; you can avoid many headaches and a lot of latency by running software locally. The only advantage network access has in that scenario is synchronizing data across multiple devices, but you do not need all the fancy HTML5 features or fast Javascript to do that; you just need a file sharing protocol.
  - sp332 13y ago
    It is not pointless to run a web app for one person's use. You could probably find a bunch of people here who do just that (I'm one of them). Standardization means that it's easy to move your data to any web service you like, and you can move your web app to any hosting provider you like. Even your own bedroom.
sp332 13y ago
The open web is supposed to prevent user lock-in and make it easy to choose where you put your data.
- anonyfuss 13y ago
  You can choose to put your data anywhere you want, as long as it's in the cloud, in plaintext and readable to the vendor.
- betterunix 13y ago
  In practice, it fails miserably at that.
shardling 13y ago
Heh, and a closed web would be better? This is kind of a borderline troll -- a nonsensical, sweeping generalization that will provoke a strong response. Let's not have this comment thread grow too deep. :)

elchief 13y ago

Mozilla just gave me a reason to consider buying their phone.

Steuard 13y ago

> This dragnet surveillance violates the First and Fourth Amendments of the U.S. Constitution, which protect citizens' right to speak and associate anonymously and guard against unreasonable searches and seizures that protect their right to privacy. The use of "protect" near the end of this sentence confuses me. Do they mean "violate"? Am I wrong to parse the final "that" as referring to the unreasonable searches? Is there any chance of clarifying this language given that this has already been made public?

sp332 13y ago
I think "that" is supposed to refer all the way back to "right" but it's very awkward.

betterunix 13y ago

So, will Mozilla be making ABP, Tor, GPG (for web forms), etc. standard features? Mozilla is actually in a position to help protect people from these sorts of intrusions. Are they willing to actually do something that might hurt their advertising industry friends in the name of protecting civil rights?

sp332 13y ago
At least they show ABP as the "most popular" add-on, and promote "Do Not Track Me" as a featured extension at https://addons.mozilla.org/ https://addons.mozilla.org/ Making Tor standard is never going to happen. It requires a lot of modifications to the browser https://www.torproject.org/projects/torbrowser/design/#Implementation https://www.torproject.org/projects/torbrowser/design/#Imple... and it's awkward to use https://www.torproject.org/download/download-easy.html.en#warning https://www.torproject.org/download/download-easy.html.en#wa...
- malandrew 13y ago
  Making Tor standard is never going to happen. It requires a lot of modifications to the browser That may be true for Gecko, but I don't see it as unreasonable to start baking security into Servo, since it is a few years from being production ready and is being built from scratch.
anonymfus 13y ago
They always can just add banner asking for donations on top of the browser window like Wikipedia did.

mrschwabe 13y ago

This is great. But what would be more impressive is if Mozilla would drop Google as Firefox's primary search engine - and instead use a non-PRISM provider such as DuckDuckGo.

jmilkbal 13y ago
Google integration, by definition, defies Mozilla's mission. I'm okay with the integration knowing that I can fix it, though I wish there were a start-up option for novices or to have it outright removed, though.
- mrschwabe 13y ago
  Exactly. At least if Mozilla would take some action to address the giant Google/NSA search box on the startup page of their browser - it would show us they are doing more than just hand-waiving about these recent revelations.
- rz2k 13y ago
  Would many novices actually care. The commentary floating around the web by people without any background in data analysis or technology seems to be that the indignity of TSA searches matters more than the actual danger of enabling future people to appoint themselves power brokers in the model of J Edgar Hoover. If novices don't care, wouldn't it just be an additional hassle?