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What I trust even less than NSA and US intelligence is Israel's. We will have even less control on which entity or agency will have access to, what places or wh

What I trust even less than NSA and US intelligence is Israel's. We will have even less control on which entity or agency will have access to, what places or whom I'm visiting.

nadav 13y ago
Salim, let me guess. You don't have a problem with all Israelis, only with the Israeli jews.
- enraged_camel 13y ago
  Stay classy.
  - deleted 13y ago
    [deleted]
- itsadok2 13y ago
  He didn't say he had a problem with Israelis at all. Just the Israel Government. Many Israelis share that sentiment: http://2jk.org/praxis/?p=4769 http://2jk.org/praxis/?p=4769 Google translation: http://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&nv=1&rurl=translate.google.com&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http://2jk.org/praxis/%3Fp%3D4769&usg=ALkJrhiFvYcaBlXERZ8ZzTTHYho9wqqMXA http://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&n...
vxNsr 13y ago
You do realize that Waze has always been an Israeli company, and you probably also know that nearly every major tech company (Google, Microsoft, Motorola, Intel, Apple, HP, etc) has an office in Israel that makes major contributions to their products.
- esrauch 13y ago
  Not trusting Israel has as much to do with hating Jews as not trusting the Vatican has to do with hating Catholics. Google is significantly less under the thumb of the Israeli government than any Israeli company is. If push came to shove Google could close their Tel Aviv operations rather than comply. They couldn't do the same with the US government and any Israeli company couldn't do the same with the Israeli government.
  - vxNsr 13y ago
    Waze never was anything but an Israeli company, so I don't understand Salim's comment, and I've removed the part about hate, because it was to political.
    - salimmadjd 13y ago
      One, I'm rather indiscriminate about my mistrust of governments. Here's an earlier thread by me regarding my mistrust of Canada, https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5849265 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5849265 Two, when my data is in US, there is still some hope that now or in the future the 4th amendment will provide some privacy. Or some amount of protection. When that data is not here, there is even less protection. Especially countries with strong motivations or history of selling or sharing intelligence. If Waze was in Saudi Arabia, Dubai/UAE, Pakistan, etc. I would have made the same comment, if anything, there is probably more transparency in Israel than the other countries I mentioned. That being said. I stand by my comment. Israel has done a great job commercializing some of their intel research into a thriving IT sector (i.e. Startup Nation) but that also makes me suspect there is strong ties between their IT sector and their intel community, hence my mistrust.
eliben 13y ago
You know why your comment reeks of politics? Because technically it doesn't make any sense. If you're a user of Waze now, if anything then the situation can improve for you. Now being a purely Israeli company Waze is surely more susceptible to Israel intelligence agencies tracking than as part of Google. Yes, it will likely become more susceptible to U.S. intelligence agencies now, but this is not what your comment was about.
ihsw 13y ago
Why would you trust any more than any other? They have access to each-other's intel infrastructure as a matter of official policy.
ysapir 13y ago
Every company operating in every country is bound to that country's laws. So Google in China has to accept the Chinese government demands, and Google Maps in Israel already cooperates with security restrictions in Israel, just like Waze probably cooperates with the NSA for its Palo Alto office. However, Waze using a dynamic map is able to provide mapping for the West Bank as well. While Google opened up its navigation app a few months ago in Israel, it has not been opened for the West Bank (possibly because of map licensing restrictions that similarly prevented opening it for Israel for so long).

What I trust even less than NSA and US intelligence is Israel's. We will have even less control on which entity or agency will have access to, what places or whom I'm visiting.

nadav 13y ago

Salim, let me guess. You don't have a problem with all Israelis, only with the Israeli jews.

enraged_camel 13y ago
Stay classy.
- deleted 13y ago
  [deleted]
itsadok2 13y ago
He didn't say he had a problem with Israelis at all. Just the Israel Government. Many Israelis share that sentiment: http://2jk.org/praxis/?p=4769 http://2jk.org/praxis/?p=4769 Google translation: http://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&nv=1&rurl=translate.google.com&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http://2jk.org/praxis/%3Fp%3D4769&usg=ALkJrhiFvYcaBlXERZ8ZzTTHYho9wqqMXA http://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&n...

vxNsr 13y ago

You do realize that Waze has always been an Israeli company, and you probably also know that nearly every major tech company (Google, Microsoft, Motorola, Intel, Apple, HP, etc) has an office in Israel that makes major contributions to their products.

esrauch 13y ago
Not trusting Israel has as much to do with hating Jews as not trusting the Vatican has to do with hating Catholics. Google is significantly less under the thumb of the Israeli government than any Israeli company is. If push came to shove Google could close their Tel Aviv operations rather than comply. They couldn't do the same with the US government and any Israeli company couldn't do the same with the Israeli government.
- vxNsr 13y ago
  Waze never was anything but an Israeli company, so I don't understand Salim's comment, and I've removed the part about hate, because it was to political.
  - salimmadjd 13y ago
    One, I'm rather indiscriminate about my mistrust of governments. Here's an earlier thread by me regarding my mistrust of Canada, https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5849265 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5849265 Two, when my data is in US, there is still some hope that now or in the future the 4th amendment will provide some privacy. Or some amount of protection. When that data is not here, there is even less protection. Especially countries with strong motivations or history of selling or sharing intelligence. If Waze was in Saudi Arabia, Dubai/UAE, Pakistan, etc. I would have made the same comment, if anything, there is probably more transparency in Israel than the other countries I mentioned. That being said. I stand by my comment. Israel has done a great job commercializing some of their intel research into a thriving IT sector (i.e. Startup Nation) but that also makes me suspect there is strong ties between their IT sector and their intel community, hence my mistrust.

eliben 13y ago

You know why your comment reeks of politics? Because technically it doesn't make any sense. If you're a user of Waze now, if anything then the situation can improve for you. Now being a purely Israeli company Waze is surely more susceptible to Israel intelligence agencies tracking than as part of Google. Yes, it will likely become more susceptible to U.S. intelligence agencies now, but this is not what your comment was about.

ihsw 13y ago

Why would you trust any more than any other? They have access to each-other's intel infrastructure as a matter of official policy.

ysapir 13y ago

Every company operating in every country is bound to that country's laws. So Google in China has to accept the Chinese government demands, and Google Maps in Israel already cooperates with security restrictions in Israel, just like Waze probably cooperates with the NSA for its Palo Alto office. However, Waze using a dynamic map is able to provide mapping for the West Bank as well. While Google opened up its navigation app a few months ago in Israel, it has not been opened for the West Bank (possibly because of map licensing restrictions that similarly prevented opening it for Israel for so long).